toy, you are trying to put words in my mouth. The Buckeye Institute is using that figure to inflame public opinion. I didn't say it was correct or incorrect. And I agreed that reform is in order as has the members of the pension system. Contrary to what you think of public employees, they also care that the state is solvent. Why would they not? Because they want to lose their pensions? Please. And I do not hate anyone telling the truth. I do despise anyone who refuses to consider all sides of issues because they see some advantage in exploiting real or imagined weaknesses in opponent positions. Yes, that I do hate. And the Buckeye Institute is clearly a mouthpiece for extremist, right wing, tea party driven agenda. Their agenda isn't to try to fix public pensions at all. They want to eliminate them because of the ongoing privatization efforts by them and groups like them. They see profits and don't want funny little things like state law in the way. The legislation isn't hard to find but since you asked, here is a start from STRS:
The amount does matter. That's why the systems are seeking legislative changes to address the shortfall. With the support of the majority of the members in those systems. That is responsible fiscal accountability seems to me. But the agenda of groups like the Buckeye Institute need to be exposed and their vitriolic propaganda which is driven by extremists needs exposed as well.
Again, Toy, you are right about the bias. The Buckeye Institute's purpose is to destroy public sector unions by swaying public opinion against public sector unions. More of the same right wing extremist agenda that has started ever since the current crew got elected in Columbus in 2010. That certainly is biased. And the figure they are using of $66 billion dollars is inflammatory to say the least. They like that. It fits into their agenda. What they don't want you to know is that there is bi-partisan legislation already passed through the Ohio senate and awaiting action in the Ohio house that addresses that short fall. All without costing the taxpayers another cent while at the same time decreasing retirement benefits and increasing eligibility rules. With the support of the majority of the systems members. Why doesn't the Buckeye Institute want you to know that? Because of their biased agenda and ulterior motives. They are a mouthpiece for right wing, tea party, extremists. Don't believe anything you hear and half of what you read.
They are both idiots. Obama with his republican light policies and Romney with his extremist views. Chances are, the would be supporters of Obama will sit it out this year and that will cause the election of Romney. That's what I think at this point. The senate election is more important. Obama is alienating his base with his turncoat policies toward various constituencies so meh, let Romney have it and elect Hillary in '16.
olddude, try to follow. Economic theory states then when the economy is slow, the last thing to do is cut spending. That just adds to the slowness. So by increasing spending, people go back to work and spend their money to stimulate the economy. As industry improves and businesses grow, tax receipts increase to cut the deficit. Who cares how big the deficit is if you can't feed your family because of the party of no and their cut cut cut class warfare trickle on pants economics that didn't work before and won't work now. That's just history. Think about it. How did we pull out of the depression? Spending and putting people to work building bridges, highways, dams, etc, not to mention WWII. Not austerity measures and Europe is waking up to this reality. Maybe the party of no will wake up also. Or preferably, be the minority party in the future.
Right on Youngstown. redvert is a shill for the anti-union, right wing extremist crowd who still think trickle down economics works. It doesn't. And Europe is waking up to the fact that stimulus is what is needed, not austerity because the rich just keep on keeping what they have because of greed. That's why Obama has overwhelming European support at the moment. I love how the anti-union crowd touts labor law as the reason the unions aren't needed. Kill the unions and find out how fast labor law is repealed. Everyone will be work 12 hours a day 7 days a week for peanuts if redvert and his 1% friends have their way.
The Buckeye Institute is an extremist organization that has an agenda against public employees. Period. To cite them as the know all end all on public pensions is folly. Do your homework Vindy. From STRS:
Earlier this month, the Buckeye Institute issued a misleading report entitled, “Taxpayers on the Hook: Taxpayer Contribution Rates for Ohio Government Pensions Outpace National Averages.” The report claims STRS Ohio’s 14% employer contribution rate is the ninth highest rate out of 34 states with similar teacher retirement programs. STRS Ohio employers do not contribute to Social Security by state law, making the STRS Ohio pension the only source of retirement income for Ohio’s educators. In reality, STRS Ohio’s employer contribution rate is below the national average when you factor in the Social Security contribution rate of 6.2% that 22 of those states make on behalf of their public educators. The report only listed the amount those states contribute to the state retirement system and failed to include the additional amount that is contributed to the Social Security program.
A more fair and accurate comparison would have noted that when the Social Security contribution is factored in, STRS Ohio’s 14% employer contribution rate ranks 20th out of the 34 states in the report. Among the 12 states that do not participate in Social Security, STRS Ohio’s rate ranks right in the middle: Illinois 24.91% Louisiana 23.70% Connecticut 19.20% Maine 17.28% Colorado 14.75% Missouri 14.50% Ohio 14.00% Kentucky 13.11% Alaska 12.56% California 10.27% Massachusetts 8.50% Texas 6.64%
Of the remaining 22 states that contribute to both a public retirement system and Social Security on behalf of their public educators, 18 of those states contribute more than 14% in combined state retirement contributions and Social Security contributions.
The Buckeye Institute report suggests that 401(k)-style retirement plans are a better alternative for Ohio’s public employees, but study after study shows that individuals enrolled in these plans are ill-prepared for retirement, as untrained, individual investors earn a significantly lower return than the professional money managers at public pension funds like STRS Ohio. It’s clear that defined benefit plans offer a greater retirement benefit at a lower cost.
These continued and unwarranted attacks on Ohio’s public pension funds and their defined benefit plans are sure to continue until the Ohio Legislature takes action on pension reform proposals that are currently on hold. Defined benefit pensions give members a retirement they can count on and stoke — rather than drain — Ohio’s struggling economy. STRS Ohio paid more than $5.5 billion in benefits during fiscal year 2010, with much of that money staying right here in Ohio, being spent on goods and services throughout the state — and that’s something all Ohioans should be thankful for.
commoncitizen, does it matter? All the more reason to pass Obama's plan to reward companies with tax incentives to bring jobs and plants back into the US. Maybe GM will do that. If GM or Chrysler had gone bankrupt, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. Since the bailout, we can now talk about making them greater companies instead. That's good for the US and the entire world isn't it?
Good editorial Vindy. And indicative of the crew currently in charge of state government. Kasich and Co have proven time and again that they are only interested in doing the bidding of their ALEC controlled handlers. SB5 was the wake up call. Their feeble attempts to keep voters away from the polls come November are just that. Feeble. The voters that shot down SB5 can't wait to vote in November. Payback is a bitch.
So where would GM and Chrysler be without the bailout? Better to have them they way they are now then not at all don't you think? And that's what would have happened. Liquidated sell off of assets and no further existence. Further economic hardship. Particularly for this area. Thank God Romney wasn't in office for that decision. I'll say it again. The republicans have to answer to Biden's charges.
GOP afraid of public employees
toy, you are trying to put words in my mouth. The Buckeye Institute is using that figure to inflame public opinion. I didn't say it was correct or incorrect. And I agreed that reform is in order as has the members of the pension system. Contrary to what you think of public employees, they also care that the state is solvent. Why would they not? Because they want to lose their pensions? Please. And I do not hate anyone telling the truth. I do despise anyone who refuses to consider all sides of issues because they see some advantage in exploiting real or imagined weaknesses in opponent positions. Yes, that I do hate. And the Buckeye Institute is clearly a mouthpiece for extremist, right wing, tea party driven agenda. Their agenda isn't to try to fix public pensions at all. They want to eliminate them because of the ongoing privatization efforts by them and groups like them. They see profits and don't want funny little things like state law in the way. The legislation isn't hard to find but since you asked, here is a start from STRS:
https://www.strsoh.org/HTML%20News%20...
May 26, 2012 at 9:30 p.m. permalink suggest removal
GOP afraid of public employees
The amount does matter. That's why the systems are seeking legislative changes to address the shortfall. With the support of the majority of the members in those systems. That is responsible fiscal accountability seems to me. But the agenda of groups like the Buckeye Institute need to be exposed and their vitriolic propaganda which is driven by extremists needs exposed as well.
May 26, 2012 at 5:11 p.m. permalink suggest removal
GOP afraid of public employees
Again, Toy, you are right about the bias. The Buckeye Institute's purpose is to destroy public sector unions by swaying public opinion against public sector unions. More of the same right wing extremist agenda that has started ever since the current crew got elected in Columbus in 2010. That certainly is biased. And the figure they are using of $66 billion dollars is inflammatory to say the least. They like that. It fits into their agenda. What they don't want you to know is that there is bi-partisan legislation already passed through the Ohio senate and awaiting action in the Ohio house that addresses that short fall. All without costing the taxpayers another cent while at the same time decreasing retirement benefits and increasing eligibility rules. With the support of the majority of the systems members. Why doesn't the Buckeye Institute want you to know that? Because of their biased agenda and ulterior motives. They are a mouthpiece for right wing, tea party, extremists. Don't believe anything you hear and half of what you read.
May 26, 2012 at 1:31 p.m. permalink suggest removal
Ohio Democrats can’t ignore 2010
They are both idiots. Obama with his republican light policies and Romney with his extremist views. Chances are, the would be supporters of Obama will sit it out this year and that will cause the election of Romney. That's what I think at this point. The senate election is more important. Obama is alienating his base with his turncoat policies toward various constituencies so meh, let Romney have it and elect Hillary in '16.
May 25, 2012 at 8:32 p.m. permalink suggest removal
The Strike That Changed The Rules
olddude, try to follow. Economic theory states then when the economy is slow, the last thing to do is cut spending. That just adds to the slowness. So by increasing spending, people go back to work and spend their money to stimulate the economy. As industry improves and businesses grow, tax receipts increase to cut the deficit. Who cares how big the deficit is if you can't feed your family because of the party of no and their cut cut cut class warfare trickle on pants economics that didn't work before and won't work now. That's just history. Think about it. How did we pull out of the depression? Spending and putting people to work building bridges, highways, dams, etc, not to mention WWII. Not austerity measures and Europe is waking up to this reality. Maybe the party of no will wake up also. Or preferably, be the minority party in the future.
May 20, 2012 at 7:24 p.m. permalink suggest removal
The Strike That Changed The Rules
Right on Youngstown. redvert is a shill for the anti-union, right wing extremist crowd who still think trickle down economics works. It doesn't. And Europe is waking up to the fact that stimulus is what is needed, not austerity because the rich just keep on keeping what they have because of greed. That's why Obama has overwhelming European support at the moment. I love how the anti-union crowd touts labor law as the reason the unions aren't needed. Kill the unions and find out how fast labor law is repealed. Everyone will be work 12 hours a day 7 days a week for peanuts if redvert and his 1% friends have their way.
May 20, 2012 at 3:50 p.m. permalink suggest removal
GOP afraid of public employees
The Buckeye Institute is an extremist organization that has an agenda against public employees. Period. To cite them as the know all end all on public pensions is folly. Do your homework Vindy. From STRS:
Earlier this month, the Buckeye Institute issued a misleading report entitled, “Taxpayers on the Hook: Taxpayer Contribution Rates for Ohio Government Pensions Outpace National Averages.” The report claims STRS Ohio’s 14% employer contribution rate is the ninth highest rate out of 34 states with similar teacher retirement programs. STRS Ohio employers do not contribute to Social Security by state law, making the STRS Ohio pension the only source of retirement income for Ohio’s educators. In reality, STRS Ohio’s employer contribution rate is below the national average when you factor in the Social Security contribution rate of 6.2% that 22 of those states make on behalf of their public educators. The report only listed the amount those states contribute to the state retirement system and failed to include the additional amount that is contributed to the Social Security program.
A more fair and accurate comparison would have noted that when the Social Security contribution is factored in, STRS Ohio’s 14% employer contribution rate ranks 20th out of the 34 states in the report. Among the 12 states that do not participate in Social Security, STRS Ohio’s rate ranks right in the middle:
Illinois 24.91%
Louisiana 23.70%
Connecticut 19.20%
Maine 17.28%
Colorado 14.75%
Missouri 14.50%
Ohio 14.00%
Kentucky 13.11%
Alaska 12.56%
California 10.27%
Massachusetts 8.50%
Texas 6.64%
Of the remaining 22 states that contribute to both a public retirement system and Social Security on behalf of their public educators, 18 of those states contribute more than 14% in combined state retirement contributions and Social Security contributions.
The Buckeye Institute report suggests that 401(k)-style retirement plans are a better alternative for Ohio’s public employees, but study after study shows that individuals enrolled in these plans are ill-prepared for retirement, as untrained, individual investors earn a significantly lower return than the professional money managers at public pension funds like STRS Ohio. It’s clear that defined benefit plans offer a greater retirement benefit at a lower cost.
These continued and unwarranted attacks on Ohio’s public pension funds and their defined benefit plans are sure to continue until the Ohio Legislature takes action on pension reform proposals that are currently on hold. Defined benefit pensions give members a retirement they can count on and stoke — rather than drain — Ohio’s struggling economy. STRS Ohio paid more than $5.5 billion in benefits during fiscal year 2010, with much of that money staying right here in Ohio, being spent on goods and services throughout the state — and that’s something all Ohioans should be thankful for.
May 20, 2012 at 6:50 a.m. permalink suggest removal
Vice President Joe Biden on stage at M7
commoncitizen, does it matter? All the more reason to pass Obama's plan to reward companies with tax incentives to bring jobs and plants back into the US. Maybe GM will do that. If GM or Chrysler had gone bankrupt, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. Since the bailout, we can now talk about making them greater companies instead. That's good for the US and the entire world isn't it?
May 16, 2012 at 7:49 p.m. permalink suggest removal
GOP should not be allowed to undermine constitution
Good editorial Vindy. And indicative of the crew currently in charge of state government. Kasich and Co have proven time and again that they are only interested in doing the bidding of their ALEC controlled handlers. SB5 was the wake up call. Their feeble attempts to keep voters away from the polls come November are just that. Feeble. The voters that shot down SB5 can't wait to vote in November. Payback is a bitch.
May 16, 2012 at 5:56 p.m. permalink suggest removal
Vice President Joe Biden on stage at M7
So where would GM and Chrysler be without the bailout? Better to have them they way they are now then not at all don't you think? And that's what would have happened. Liquidated sell off of assets and no further existence. Further economic hardship. Particularly for this area. Thank God Romney wasn't in office for that decision. I'll say it again. The republicans have to answer to Biden's charges.
And Walter, that was funny, I have to say.
May 16, 2012 at 5:45 p.m. permalink suggest removal