Steve, So you are using your freedom of free speech to say you are against freedom of speech? How is that different from someone not "standing" for freedom?
You are the one who should move to another country where the government or the majority can tell you what you should do when it comes to government. People came to America to have freedom - sit or stand - that's freedom. Bullying children into doing what you want them to do is unpatriotic. BTW, we will believe anything you pro-Pledgers have to say about the Pledge is serious when we see you out pledging the flag every day - as you would force kids to do.
How soon we forget that Jehovah's Witnesses in Nazi Germany were among the first to be persecuted for refusing to stand during the Sieg Heil salute, which so closely resembles our Pledge of Allegiance. Forcing this upon our citizens, and especially our children, crosses a line that is un-American. And when you consider this is mostly elementary school age kids, it amounts to little more than bullying.
Every American should understand that there is more to the Supreme Court ruling that applies here than just declaring it unconstitutional to force kids to stand for the Pledge. The majority opinion in West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, written by Justice Robert Jackson in 1943, became one of the great statements in American constitutional law and history.
"If there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation, it is that no official, high or petty, can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion or force citizens to confess by word or act their faith therein."
The true legacy of Barnette is less its jurisprudence than its defense of the principles of freedom. Justice Jackson continued, "Those who begin coercive elimination of dissent soon find themselves exterminating dissenters. Compulsory unification of opinion achieves only the unanimity of the graveyard."
I would ask you to stop and think for a minute what kind of patriot you, yourself, are by where you stand on this basic principal we call freedom.
--More at: http://members.cox.net/patriotismforall/
November 27, 2009 at 2:44 p.m.
We will believe anything you pro-Pledgers have to say about the Pledge is serious when we see you out pledging the flag every day - as you would force little kids to be do.
First, let's get one thing clear, the flag or Pledge to it have never been about honoring soldiers and war. It is cloying and irrelevant to suggest otherwise. (America's unquestioning devotion at the altar of militarism is another subject.)
November 19, 2009 at 12:12 p.m.
Another angle to make you think twice about supporting the nationalism in the Pledge.
Every conservative should be opposed to the Pledge on principle as contrary to the principles of a Federated Republic. When first introduced by the national socialist, Francis Bellamy, brother of the famous socialist activist Edward Bellamy, conservatives viewed the Pledge with great suspicion. Why? Because of the then foreign concept of pledging allegiance to “one nation”.
To Americans of the late 19th century, “allegiance” was a feudal concept denoting subservience to a master. Americans considered themselves sovereigns, not subjects. They feared that the natural supremacy of the individual over his government, as reflected by the Declaration of Independence and guaranteed in the constitutions of the United States and of the several states, might eventually be overturned by the ideas expressed in the Pledge.
They, unlike so many Americans today, understood that those who exercise the instruments of government — public servants — feel more comfortable ruling than serving.
More on the Pledge at:More at: http://members.cox.net/patriotismforall/
November 18, 2009 at 12:41 p.m.
Hey, we will believe anything you pro-Pledge folks have to say about the Pledge is serious when we see you out pledging the flag every day as you would force little kids to be doing.
And, let's get one thing clear, people already moved to a country, one where they could have freedom of expression - it is this one, or used to be before so many got on the Christian fascists. You do know that the Pledge written by a national socialist, don't you and was the model for Hitlers stiff armed salute for his national socialist party.
More importantly, how soon we forget that Jehovah's Witnesses in Nazi Germany were among the first to be persecuted for refusing to stand during the Sieg Heil salute, which so closely resembles our Pledge of Allegiance. Forcing this upon our citizens, and especially young children, crosses a line that is un-American. And when you consider this is mostly elementary school age kids, it amounts to little more than bullying.
November 18, 2009 at 12:39 p.m.