Of the 29 states that have voted on this particular issue, all 29 have voted to preserve traditional marriage.
If they relax the standards that define marriage the next step will be that someone will want to marry their favorite sheep !
It says a lot that the most liberal state in the union, California, would vote to preserve traditional marriage. Obama's #1 demographic, African Americans, voted 70%-30% in favor of Prop 8. Hell a total of 32% of Obama voters in CA voted for Prop 8.
The five states that allow gay marriage only allow it because the state legislature's made it legal. I'd be willing to bet if the citizens of those five states voted on it, it would likely be banned as well.
This type of thing should be governed at the state level. Marriages in the traditional sense aren't licensed by the Federal government, why would/should that change?
Why does this even matter? This is just another excuse for Stan to talk about his favorite subject: Gay men lusting after sheep.
Yeah, no issues there...
It's kind of strange that a lot of straight people are choosing to not marry and gay people want to marry. I don't know why people would voluntarily involve the government in their personal life but that's just my opinion.
Since I live in California I can give a first hand account on the whole Prop. 8 deal. First of all it was yet another "special ballot". It seems like we have them every few months at about 50 million per. I'm sick of them. If you want to save the state of Ohio a ton of money, avoid any special elections or ballot measures.
Before the election we were bombarded with television, mailings and telephone calls all day and night. I mean real fire and brimstone s**t. I have caller ID on my phone. I would get calls from Kansas, Utah, Oklahoma, you name it. A giant pain in the a**. You know who was spending millions of dollars to defeat gay marriage? It was the Mormon and Catholic churches.
The Mormon church who believes that marriage is a sacred institution between a man and a woman and a woman and a woman and a woman and a woman.....!
The Catholic church who wont allow their clergy to marry but consider themselves an authority on the subject and whose clergy were either involved in decades of serial child molestation or the cover up of it.
When it came time to vote I voted in favor of the gays. If it makes them happy, who am I to say no to someone else's happiness? There are states that have gay marriage and I haven't heard of anything bad happening to anyone as a result.
As far as the sacred institution of marriage, I googled the percentage of divorces and what percentage of people are happy in their marriage and the results were so varied that anyone could find a web site to back up their own view. I wouldn't put much stock in any stats anyone offered. Go with your own experience. How many people do you know that have gotten divorced? How many married people do you know that don't seem happy in their marriage? I don't think gay people getting married will have any effect on the success we heterosexuals have had.
Just wait Cambridge. When these people wake up in the mornings and can't decide if they want to be gay or straight from one day to the next, then we'll see how high the divorce rate will be if they're allowed to marry in the first place.
If you want a civil union, fine. But, I'm sorry -- marriage is between a man and a woman.
I see absolutely nothing wrong with a man marrying a woman or a woman marrying a man !
Yeah, traditional marriage has been such a success with half of all hetero marriages ending in divorce, we need to protect that!
Come on people, allowing gays to marry isn't going to change anything for us heteros.
Why do we feel the need to discriminate against a group over such a simple concept? Everyone should have the same rights.
You religious fanatics really need to quit trying to keep gays in the closet and address your churches problem with child molestors.
Bottom line is Gays need to stop calling it a marriage, which is a sacred union between a man and a woman under God. If they call it a Civil Union that is one thing, which can be recognized under law and can give them the same benefits that men and women have, but not recognized under God. I can compromise with that.
What California do you live in? Prop 8 was not a special election. It was a part of the general election ballot in 2008.
The Obama presidency, drawing a lot of Black and Hispanic voters to the polls, probably contributed highly to the passage of the amendment. While those demographics largely support Democratic candidates, they are also highly religious (Catholic).
California, "land of fruits and nuts" California emergency rooms just added a new category in their computers of injuries that they have treated 'mostly for free" The category is, you guessed it "Biotch slapped!
Woody....You're probably right on what election that was an issue. My bad. We have so many it's hard to keep track on when you voted for what. We just had another special ballot vote this month. I'm not against the propositions but I wish they would just stick to the normal election cycle.
You're also right on the demographics that accounted for the outcome of the vote. The Mormon and Catholic churches knew who's buttons to push and how to push them. Their adds used every angle you could think of. Certain ethnic groups seem to have a higher level of machismo and I think that also was a contribution. I worked in Puerto Rico for awhile. One day at lunch I was reading the local English language newspaper and there was an article on the high rate of aids in Puerto Rico. I mentioned it to a coworker and he said it was a big problem. I asked him, "a lot of gays in Puerto Rico?". He answered no it was from shooting drugs and that there are "no gay Puerto Recons" and I immediately replied no gay Italians either. Then we both laughed.
I stand by what I said about both churches. I spent 12 years in Catholic school and that church needs to get it's own house in order before it starts telling other people how to live their lives.
Gay Mafia!!!! Ugh!!!!San Fransicko, Ugh!!!!
cambridge, I have to respond to your little "me bad" on your original Prop 8 statement as being a special ballot instead of being part of the general election. A couple weeks back you gave a well formatted presentation on the differences between the red and the blue states. You used a very general data set that worked for your point of view. I think you stated what you meant to say on the prop 8 issue and got caught. If I am wrong I would advise you to think and research before you just make blanket statements and assume that everyone will automatically believe it because you live in Ca.. Kind of like stating that people in California are begging to have their taxes raised. The tax payers no, the non tax payers yes.
If women's suffrage had had to be decided by a ballot measure in 1920, I can guarantee you, women would still be waiting for the right to vote. Most men and many, many women were adamantly against giving women political voice. And if segregation had had to be decided with a vote, schools and water fountains would still be divided by race.
Almost without exception, every law on our books that has increase equality between American citizens has come from the legislature or the judiciary -- not from public support. The court of public opinion is usually the last to support equal rights, be they for women, minorities, or gays. I have no doubt that in 50 years, our grandchildren will be scratching their heads wondering why our culture was so bigoted and filled with hate about something as basic as the right to be legally joined with the person of our choice.
50 years from now our grandchildren will be scratching their heads and wondering how the greatest counrty the world had ever know up to that point managed to F*** it all up in such a short time.
If people continue to warp the institution of marriage to include males with males and females with females then human superiority in thinking will be surpassed by the animal world.
Adam and Eve got it right from the beginning!
I think Leviticus 20:13 should answer all questions in regards to homosexuality. There are no exceptions for it. The Bible doesn't say anything about the marriage or civil union issue in regards to the abomination that it is, but states strongly to the act itself. OBEY IT !! People shouldn't use the church or its officials to help justify the abomination. It is just as much an abomination for them as well and will be dealt with accordingly. This is a reult of a Godless society. You have a choice to make for your judgement. Choose wisely because you will have to answer for the lust of the flesh one day.
NOT EVERYONE IS A GODDAMN CHRISTIAN!
NOT EVERYONE IS STUPID EITHER ! So, you dont lke the parameters of morality?
No, I don't like YOUR parameters.And I know not everyone is stupid.But I wouldn't call blindly following the word of a supposed god from a book written by man "intelligent."
You're the type to make agnostics, atheists, etc. REALLY dislike Christians. Shoot, I bet plenty of other Christians dislike you.I know they're not allll like you...at least I keep telling myself that.
Enjoy your life here on the Vindy boards, it's seems to be your primary(only) source of entertainment.I think by now, everyone knows your views.Do you have ANYTHING new to bring to the table?Or are you just going to keep spouting the same ol' one-liners?
Do me a favor, don't address me in any more posts, it's obvious you don't genuinely have any interest in what my opinions are.
"Enjoy your life here on the Vindy boards, it's seems to be your primary(only) source of entertainment."
You are liberal with your entertainment ! Your opinions may be inspiring to someone but to me they are pure entertainment !
If marriage is a sacred holy union, it shouldn't be regulated by the government. Separation of Church and State. Let the state pass out civil unions to couples and the church decide who is married.
So who posted this on a left wing forum. It was 65-35% the other day... No way it changes that much over the weekend without this being posted somewhere lol.
Cant tell which way your headed? Well you're not alone.
THIS CAT HAS NO SENSE OF DIRECTION EITHERhttp://i44.tinypic.com/j6ldg8.jpg
Denial of what rights? The laws have been relaxed and it isn't illegal to practic homosexual sex anymore. Animals are still off limits. Do you want the rules relaxed further?
Start your own religion and marry. Marry anything you like. Don't expect me to sanction sinfulness by putting it in the same league as a heterosexual marriage.
Gay Mafia....UghSan Fransicko....Ugy
Spare us oh God!!!!!!
It's not quantum physics !
You have the same rights as I do. What makes you think that you are so special and need special rights?
So you think that we should stone women who have sex with guys? Your thinking is v e r r y interesting. So woman to woman sex would be ok with you then? If computers were programmed like the minds of gays and lesbians they would all crash in a very short time. Could gays and lesbians be considered handicapped?
It seems to me it's married Republican politicians from all over this country, Evangelical preachers and priest that keep getting caught with other men, male prostitutes and chasing around little boys.
The point of discussion is allowing gay "marriages". The definition of marriage is between a man and a woman PERIOD.I have no issues with same sex.......life partners......civil union...... whatever as long as it is NOT called marriage.Quail you do have some valid questions that probably can't be answered but please show me a religion - any religion that allows same-sex marriages?The issue I see brought up most often is the benefit packages from employers and "family only" medical consent forms - neither of which I have opposition to. If you are commited to that person you should be entitiled to the same benefits as a hetero union. Being the quintessent misanthrope, it would be that much easier to "marry" to gain citizenship or the more extreme bastardization of the law to allow animals/inanimate objects, etc. in the future.Think I'm crazy? Think back to the smoking law that simply banned smoking in resturants only a short time ago - now there are laws forbidding smoking in your own home and even outdoors.
Cambridge - two words ....... Barney Frank
A Democratic senator that had a gay prositution ring run by his boyfriend from Frank's home ring a bell?Just because there is a double standard out there doesn't polarize the issue to Repubs and Dems.
You're comment is purely to rile the religious right. Try again
My previous comment was a response to "papamaffia". As you can see his comment was removed. If you read my response it shouldn't be to hard to figure out why.
And you need to loose that username. All Italians are taught two things from birth. There is no such thing as the Mafia and NEVER talk on the phone.
Traditional Marriage: What straight people have managed to screw up for centuries....
Marriage wasn't for me, they can have it.
Let grown adults marry who they want.
Gay mafia......get outta my lifeSan Fransicko.....get a lifePervs
Quail wants me to say that gay is ok because we dont stone women. Right Quail? Seems like in the Bible a more serious issue is raised and the destruction of sodom and gomorrah is recorded. Is Frisco ready for the big quake or is God going to more tolerant this time around?
Laughable, the lot of you.
I have compiled the effects of exposing our society to gay marriage. The results are quite shocking. Take a look.
"Homosexuality hastened the fall of great nations like Greece and Rome"
Wait a second!
You really don't know *anything* about greece or rome do you? Just say for instance I agreed with you. Bringing up greece or rome is probably the worst thing you could say.
For about 800 years the greeks and romans each were godless heathens having sex with anything that moved. They didn't care if it was man, woman or sheep (for Stan.) However! They also invented democracy, the army, philosophy, geometry, medicine, engineering (that wasn't based on mud, straw & slaves) and a little something you've never heard of called "reason".
To sum it up, the western civilization ProAmerican is so proud is a direct result of those earlier and not-so-straight civilizations.
The gays of today aren't into anything more spectaculal than dressing up in bubble wrap. I doubt if they were doing anything productive back then either.Perhaps they should be seeking a cure for aids to save their culture?
If we start stoning women for straight sex then we should punish gays for deviate sexual intercourse. Right? As you very well know the Bible doesn't condone deviate sexual intercourse.
So because we dont stone women you believe that gay is ok. Right? You seem to evade this point.
So TheQuail thinks that being gay is clever ? Your right ! I could never be that clever.
Now what do propose that we do with those clever gays in keeping with the word of The Bible?
It would seem that those setting the rules here in Ohio have more sense than the gays.
BUT HEY WHAT ARE RULES ?FILL IN THE BLANKS AND YOU ARE MARRIED !
Definition of Marriage Ohio Constitution Article XV § 11
"Only a union between one man and one woman may be a marriage valid in or recognized by this state and its political subdivisions. This state and its political subdivisions shall not create or recognize a legal status for relationships of unmarried individuals that intends to approximate the design, qualities, significance or effect of marriage."
Adopted November 2, 2004.
As far as the state and country is concerned, marriage is a legal contract and nothing more. There need be no priest, rabbi, blessing, Bible, Koran, ring, candle, prayer, or any other remotely religious prop present for any man and any woman above the age of 18 to walk into any courthouse in the land with about $50 and get married. There is absolutely nothing special, holy, or even sentimental about civil ceremonies. People are not even required to be religious to get married by the state and enjoy all the built-in benefits that come with having a sheet of paper signed by a judge that says they are married. Heck, they don't even have to know each other.
The judge performing a ceremony doesn't care if the couple attends a church, synagogue, or mosque or even if nothing at all. They can be of different races, ages, generations, social class, professions, or ethnicities. They can be convicted murderers or rapists. They can be high school drop-outs with no jobs. They could have married a dozen times before and have 50 kids each. People don't have to be Christian, American, literate, employed, happy, or in some cases even sober to get married. The state doesn't care in the least. So why .. no, how the hell can the state possibly give a flying you-know-what, if the two people standing in front of that judge are of the same sex?
Furthermore, every so-called Christian who believes that same-sex marriage is the single greatest threat to the family structure, should really take a close look at their own adherence to what God says about marriage. I know many of the people preaching from their soapbox about the sanctity of marriage have themselves been divorced, have had children out of wedlock, have broken their vows, and in general have contributed greatly to the demise of the traditional "Christian" family.
As I pointed out 10 years ago as a college student, the Christian faith doesn't treat people who've broken Commandments with the same scorn and judgment as it does gays and lesbians. Last I checked, the Commandments were the Big 10 rules of the Bible, yet people break them and marry all the time with not threat of fire and brimstone if they don't see the error of their ways. Churches allow adulterers and murderers, blasphemers, and people who work on Sunday to get married all the time. They are not called abominations whose souls need to be prayed for. Yet somehow, this little footnote in the middle of Leviticus is waved around as though it were the Bible's subtitle. Explain to me how this makes sense.
Being gay is to scorn life itself. It is of no use whatsoever !
Stan, you know what are of "no use whatsoever?" I'll give you a hint. There are currently 1126 of them. Does that number sound familiar?
lol, that was awesome!
Well, what useful value does being gay have?
What could be better than being a pothead and gay? Gays couldn't have parades ( aka charades ) under socialism in Russia. Better watch what you wish for.
BTW we already know where the WAD's are !
ProMerkin.....The white man dominates the Republican Party. Look how well that's working out.
Our President is half white and he can't even get all of of his fellow Democrats to agree on anything !
Somehow it seems to me that however mankind was created either thru the theory of creativity or thru evolution that if the gay aspect was a part of it then two of these gays could reproduce without the aid of the opposite sex. Even 99% of the wild animals get mad if another of the same sex tries to jump them. So by not being able to make more little gays or gayets I guess there is a attempt by whomever or whatever to try to keep the he-ing and she-ing at a minimum.
The American Medical Association, The American Psychiatric Association, The American Psychological Association, The American Psychoanalytical Association, The American Academy of Pediatrics, and The National Association of Social Workers all agree that sexual orientation is not a choice and that there is nothing wrong with homosexuality. But what do they know, right?
Since homosexuality is clearly not something that people can simply choose, there is no reason to not grant them state marriages. Churches don't have to sanction a marriage if they don't want to, but as long as the government is giving benefits to married couples, there is no reason for them to deny all the benefits to same-sex couples that heterosexual couples enjoy.
"those "professional" organizations you sited are leftest frauds"
Not a lick of proof as usual... :-)
The only other group that would probably agree with you is the Church of Scientology. They hate gays AND psychiatrists. Sounds like a match made in thetan heaven. You can borrow Stan's tinfoil hat for the trip to Venus with Tom Cruise.
"Also, the vast majority of pedophiles are homosexuals"
That was a study done by the family research council, an anti-gay religious activism group with an agenda. Not everything you read on the "Rapture Ready" forums is ready for prime time. Some of us don't take random yahoos on the internet at their word. We actually look up what their saying...
Secretly the "libs" you rail against want you to keep blathering incoherently on a public forum. Have you ever read posts by The Quail? Keep reminding people of why they voted for Obama. It will lead us all into a dark place in a few years...
President Biden ;-)
ProMerkin.....You keep talking about. losing freedoms. Freedom used to mean free to own slaves, then free to segregate and free to keep women from voting. Discrimination is wrong. This isn't even about gays. It's about discrimination that takes away someone else's freedoms. Many RealAmericans fought and died for all Americans to be free. Many of them Gay.
You're the one sticking their nose in someone else's business. You seem to have a category for everyone. Your rants about the white race speak volumes about who you really are. There is only one thing about your post that really bother me personally and that's your username.
What really bothers you Cambridge is the fact that your rantings an ravings are irrelevant ! Oh how the tail tries to wag the dog !
The blacks who voted Obama into office along with whites voters talk about a black man in office. So just the black part is President while the white part is extra baggage?
Stan the Man Unusual....Obama's race has nothing to do with him being President. He is the right person at the right time. I don't see his race being brought up except by raciest. I think about a person's race as often as I think about if someone is gay or not, which is never.
Tell that to Biden ! When I bring up the white part of Obama those that voted for the black part get hostile. Would you call that racist ?
BTW I am not a racist but a conservative. Alan Keyes would make a fine President !
GOOD JUDGEMENT ALONG WITH THE BACKBONE AND CHARISMA TO LEAD !http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/pol...
What ever happened to seperation of church and state? Why is it that every time I turn around the church is always given the secular thought or practices the boot, yet the church and the christian community always want thier views and opinions implanted in the secular community!? I dont get it. I think alot of Evangelicals and other So called Christians in the Valley area just pick and choose what they want to enforce on the rest of the community, homosexuality being at the top of the list. I know personally many people(mostly men) in the Youngstown area who speak out against gay marriage, yet I know, again, personally that some of them have had and are having affairs, unbeknownst to thier famalies and friends, some even with other men. But dear Lord, Why homosexuality, what about addiction, infedelity, divorce, and even crime and racism? What about those issues? Those issues always seem to be overlooked or easily forgiven. I dont get it. I never understood why folks seem to think that thier communities and ways of life will be destroyed if gays are given the same rights as straights? Lets face it Ohio, within the next decade, its inevitable......Gays will have the legal right to marry, not just in Ohio but most likely all 50 states. I garauntee it. I Predict that gays will also be serving openly in the military by years end. If the straights dont want the gay community to shove thier "lifestyle" down thier throats, then I ask why dont the straights, and the Christians, and Evangelicals stop doing it to everyone else? I cant believe that there are still people out there who wish that thier family members were murderers, rather than homosexuals. NUTS! I just moved back to the valley from Charlotte North Carolina, and let me tell you, folks down there in the deep south are way more progressive and peaceful about social issues such as gay marriage than they are here. I dont plan on staying here that much longer, but I feel bad for the gays and lesbians in this community, living under such hate and synicism. Maybe thats part of the reason Youngstown looks the way it does? You valley residents really must move forward about a decade or so, that might help-just a little bit. By the way I am a devout Catholic and attend mass twice a week at Saint Columba in Youngstown, and Saint Paul in Salem. Just Fyi. God Bless everyone. And I do mean EVERYONE.
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