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Enforce the law, then ask for more



Published: Thu, January 24, 2013 @ 12:00 a.m.

Enforce the law, then ask for more

One point made by oppo- nents of further gun control is that existing laws are often not vigorously enforced or prosecuted. An example of this emerged from the recent discussion chaired by Vice President Biden. The representative of the NRA pointed to the low level of prosecutions for falsifying Form 4473 (filed by would-be purchasers under the National Instant Check System) and the low level of felony prosecutions for gun crimes in general. Incredibly, the vice president replied that the government is too busy to do this.

According to figures unearthed by the Daily Caller, in 2010, prosecutors considered 22 cases of information falsification. Forty additional cases ended up before prosecutors for other reasons related to unlawful possession. Of these 62, only 44 were prosecuted. However, there were 72,600 applications denied on the basis of background checks. Prosecutions per capita in 2011 were down 35 percent from the peak during the Bush administration in 2004. It should be noted that a felon attempting to purchase a firearm through NICS may be comitting a felony.

Maybe the administration should try enforcing laws that already exist before attempting to further restrict our freedom. Furthermore, if they are already too busy to enforce existing laws, what good does it do to pass more?

Patrick J. Lally, Youngstown


Comments

1HappyBob(285 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

The sad truth is:

People who are convinced that the government (that we elect) is evil ....will never be convinced otherwise.

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2SeriouslyNow(192 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

The only source for the Vice-President's response is Jim Baker of the NRA, who said that to the Daily Caller. No other corroboration.
A very interesting article in another online website - The Gun Guy - has an attorney discussing the fact that thousands of people fail the Brady check and what to do about it. here is that link:http://gunguy.tempdomainname.com/nicsfail.htm.

That people are not prosecuted for perjury on the 4473 form is not really the point. The point is that if you fail the Brady check, you will not get a gun from that dealer. To that extent, not transferring the gun to a Brady denied person is the effect that is sought.

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3excel(276 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

DHS bought 450 million hand gun bullets to protect us after we are disarmed. That is what the Department Of Homeland security is all about.

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4SeriouslyNow(192 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

@hman,
Question certainly. But the questioning should be based on something besides paranoid delusion.
Never said that all government is good.... that's your interpretation on my comment.
You get the government that you elect.

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5SeriouslyNow(192 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

@hman,
Sorry my mistake. I confused your comments with someone else.

I've been looking at the form 4473, and I must say that I don't know how a dealer goes about determining if the person is using a false identity.

I've no idea why DHS ordered that much ammo, nor any idea if that is abnormal.

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6SeriouslyNow(192 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

DHS ammo purchase... see link:

http://www.politifact.com/texas/state...

Truth or not truth ? At least the bulk purchasing concept is plausible.

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7Rockyroad(149 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

NORFOLK, VA—According to numerous reports, local 62-year-old Earl Bailey, who owns a shotgun and several boxes of ammunition, is currently the last bastion of defense between the United States of America and the federal government’s full-scale takeover.
Bailey, a recent retiree and a proud advocate of gun rights, and is, at present, the only person capable of preventing top-secret forces within the government from striking and forcefully coercing hundreds of millions of Americans to submit to a fascist and brutal New World Order.
“It is every American’s right to be good and armed, and that’s a right that should always be protected,” said Bailey, now the sole American protecting the nation from the government’s hidden plot of disarming all citizens, gradually gaining control of the mass media, and installing martial law throughout the nation’s streets. “Our Founding Fathers intended for each and every one of us to protect ourselves from tyranny. That’s what America is all about.”
“What happens when the feds show up at your front door and start telling you how much meat you can eat or how to raise your kids?”
Bailey, who keeps his gun on his person at all times has reportedly struck dread into the very highest-ranking members of the U.S. government. According to sources, top government and military officials are fully aware that they remain unable to commence with their oppressive, systematic subjugation of the American populace as long as the 62-year-old owner of a rifle exists.
“The way I see it, the Second Amendment’s been keeping this nation free and secure for well over 200 years,” Bailey said, valiantly standing in front of his home that is constantly being monitored by CIA agents and elite Special Forces operatives, who are told to maintain a safe distance from the formidable 62-year-old. “First they’ll come for our guns and next…well, shoot, I don’t really plan on ever seeing what the hell happens next.”
While the federal government is more than adequately prepared to begin the first phase of its plan of convoying Second Amendment adherents to newly established FEMA concentration camps, high-level members of the Obama Administration involved in the widespread conspiracy confirmed that they have been forced to resort to alternate methods due solely to Bailey’s heroics.
“As long as there’s someone like Earl out there with a gun and ammunition, we are unable to carry out our attack on America,” said Maxwell Caufield, a covert military leader in charge of the operation to turn the country into an authoritarian, one-party state wherein the basic rights of citizens are stripped away in order to create total government control. “Try as we did to spread our distorted gun control propaganda—claiming that it would protect innocent people across the country from needless deaths—the man just wouldn’t bite.
“You’ve got to hand it to him, really,” Caufield added. “If it weren’t for Earl, you’d be looking at a totally different country.”

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8Rockyroad(149 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

FAIRFAX, VA—National Rifle Association Executive Vice President and CEO Wayne LaPierre said Monday that somewhere around 1,000 kids would have to die in a school shooting in order for the organization to reconsider their longstanding opposition to gun control.

"Yeah, that's probably the only way we'd reassess much of anything at this point: 1,000 dead kids, shot up pretty good, lying face down in the school auditorium or something like that," LaPierre said, noting that anything less than 1,000 dead kids would not be enough for the NRA to stop urging Congress to pass pro-gun legislation. "I mean, that's just a ballpark number, but I imagine seeing 1,000 or so body bags being wheeled out of a school and a whole town of crying parents would probably make us reflect on our values for at least a little bit."

"So yeah, more or less 1,000 dead kids," LaPierre added. "Something around there. And teachers don't count."

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9Rockyroad(149 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

"For us to come anywhere close to reassessing our beliefs, it's gotta be one of those deals where a ton of kids get their heads blown off in school and there is one of those big, town-wide memorial services where they read off all the names of all the dead kids and you feel like, wow, that has to be somewhere around 1,000 names," said LaPierre, adding that seeing pictures of all the dead kids in front of the "pastor or whoever is doing the eulogies or whatever" might be a sobering enough visual for the NRA to reconsider whether it should be harder, not easier, to acquire firearms. "And I think the shooter would also have to use around 30 different types of guns in the shooting in order for us to rethink what the Founding Fathers intended when they wrote the Second Amendment."

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10HappyBob(285 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

@Rockyroad.
your comments are a perfect example of trolling. The remarks by NRA that you cite were INVENTED by the folks at The Onion back in May 2012

http://www.theonion.com/articles/nra-...

Portraying fiction (or satire) as fact does nothing to advance an adult discussion.

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1176Ytown(1193 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

Laws don't deter people from getting guns. There are laws on the books that make it mandatory to have a drivers license, auto insurance, permission to work in our country, a prescription for certain drugs,and on and on.

Mental health background checks are only as good as past record. Where do we draw the line on what would be considered a mental health issue that would deny a gun purchase? If you went to a doctor 5 years ago for a brief period of depression, would you be denied a gun purchase based on that diagnosis? If, as a child you were diagnosed with ADD or autism should you be denied a gun permit? Would those records be available once you reached adulthood? What if you had no history of any type of illness but after being approved for a gun permit you snapped?

This whole issue is so complicated. Regarding school shootings, this is from an article by the US Secret Servie National Threat Assessment Center: "almost every attacker had engaged in behavior before the shooting that seriously concerned at least one adult - and for many had concerned three or more different adults. The findings from the study suggest that some school attacks may be preventable, and that students can play an important role in prevention efforts http://www.secretservice.gov/ntac_ssi...

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12SeriouslyNow(192 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

@hman...The false identity problem is real. I'm looking at the ATF 4473 and the dealer is admonished to "know your customer". A valid government issued photo ID is the primary document. There is a question for social security number, however that is optional.
So you have detected another "loophole".

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13poland21(92 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

@76Ytown - great post and link. It concerns me that "school security" and "gun control" are becoming one and the same. School shootings generally involve 1) someone known to the school 2) prior incidents with the individual 3) access to a legally purchased gun

School Resource officers providing education to students, staff and parents about what to report can easily become the singular point of info to "connect the dots". Requirements for locked storage of guns helps reduce access.

Armed guards in school are not the answer, and locked doors and buzzers were in place at Sandy Hook and did not prevent that tragedy.

Training and awareness are the key components for schools.

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14HappyBob(285 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

By loophole I simply mean that it is a mechanism whereby a person circumvents the intent of the law. The intent of the Brady check is to try to prevent certain people from purchasing guns.
On the other hand the process of used in Ohio to get a CCW permit is significantly tighter, including fingerprints and a trip to the Sheriff office. Maybe that is what it takes to achieve the goal.

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15Rockyroad(149 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

Hey "HappyBob, no one presented those remarks as "facts". At its best it is gallows humor and parody. But, it is not far-removed from right-wing lunacy at all...it reflects perfectly on the NRA and on the rest of you conspiracy-theory, government-hating, Navy Seal Wannabees.

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16HappyBob(285 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

The pieces on the NRA responses and the Earl Bailey piece were both presented in the 'news report format' that is typical of The Onion. All three of your comments were directly taken from The Onion without attribution.

I can enjoy satire, but you could have stated that your comments were lifted from another copyrighted publication. Otherwise, it appears to be a "honest" news story.

Tell me it's a joke, then I can enjoy it for what its worth.

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17VINDYAK(1799 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

Since rockyroad wants to lather up his anti NRA foaming, present his left wing lies and parodies and continue to insult 4.5 million NRA members and 80 million gun owners, I have this as food for thought for him...the NRA is the largest Civil Rights Advocate in the world!

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18HappyBob(285 comments)posted 1 year, 5 months ago

The NRA says that there are 70-80 million gun owners. The NRA also claims 4.2 million members. So yes you are correct that vast majority of gun owners are not NRA members.
However, the NRA has put themselves out there to speak for gun owners.

It is the NRA (self-proclaimed spokespersons for the gun owners of America) who is pushing back on background checks. No one had to create a boogyman, the NRA did that all on their own.

As far as the states pushing back, almost half of the states have their own background check system.

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