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The Lemon Grove on its third name, business model



Published: Wed, August 21, 2013 @ 12:08 a.m.

Former Lemon Grove beset by low lunch crowds, management issues

photo

The Lemon Grove, a downtown bar and restaurant, is using its third name in four months. The business, which is struggling to attract a lunch crowd, is now the Knox Building in honor of it being the former site of an S.H. Knox Co. store.

By David Skolnick

and Jamison Cocklin

news@vindy.com

YOUNGSTOWN

In the span of just four months, the Lemon Grove is on its third name and third business model.

But Jacob Harver, co-owner of the downtown bar and restaurant at 110 W. Federal St., said the business — renamed the Knox Building — is “not in danger of closing.”

While nearby restaurants were busy with customers eating lunch Tuesday afternoon both inside and outside, there was only one customer at the Knox having a soft drink.

Attracting a lunch crowd has been a long-standing problem at the restaurant, which opened at 122 W. Federal St. in August 2009, and moved in June 2012 to 110 W. Federal St., the former location of the Rosetta Stone Cafe and Lounge, which went out of business in August 2010.

Bringing in Guy’s Barbecue three months ago to run the business’s food service and changing the name to Guy’s at the Grove turned out to be a failure.

“I turned it over to Guy’s to see what they could do and it didn’t work as well as I hoped,” Harver said. “Nighttime is always our best. We’ve packed them in the past two weekends, but lunch didn’t do well.”

A new company taking over the food service will be announced later this week, the same time Guy’s will leave, he said.

Another decision made by Harver has drawn concern from other downtown business owners.

Harver hired Brent Furrie, who has run clubs and bars, to help run the Knox’s bar and nightclub area.

Harver says Furrie is a “renowned club owner” who “knows the business and is a great promoter.”

Furrie is also a convicted felon, sentenced in January 2004 to seven years in prison for attempted felonious assault, attempted improper discharge of a firearm at or into a habitation, and a firearms specification for firing a gun at a man outside a Boardman home. The man was not hit, but bullets hit the house. He’s had numerous other arrests dating back to 1997.

Furrie managed Rumors Lounge on North Meridian Road in Austintown, which was destroyed after two arsons in three days in March 2011.

The Mahoning County Prosecutor’s Office filed an injunction in March 2012 to close Shotz Bar & Grille on Oakwood Avenue in Austintown, also managed by Furrie, after state liquor agents issued 17 citations to patrons of the bar for underage alcohol sales and criminal activities on Shotz’s grounds. Last January, a deal was struck to keep the bar open as long as it operates legally and does not present a public nuisance.

In an Aug. 6 email to Mayor Charles Sammarone and Police Chief Rod Foley, Christian Rinehart, owner of O’Donold’s Irish Pub at 122 W. Federal St. [the original location of the Lemon Grove], wrote that after making a significant investment in downtown he “believed it necessary to put a stop” to any involvement Furrie might have with the Knox Building’s business operations.

“You can understand I’m not against the Lemon Grove, or a good operation coming in,” Rinehart wrote, “but one [incident] can end anything we as a group have accomplished in the downtown Youngstown area.”

Rinehart is not alone in his concern.

Anthony Farris, the city law director, said the email represents “concerns about the kind of crowd that would be brought in because of the new manager, and owners have expressed some of their concerns about the way he’s operated certain establishments in the past.”

Harver said Rinehart is concerned about losing profits to a new business model at the Knox Building. He said he’s been working closely with Rinehart and other nearby bar owners to allay concerns and continue development of the downtown entertainment district.

“Because someone has a felony conviction, if they served their time it shouldn’t be a factor in how a person does his job,” Harver said. “His track record of promoting clubs is well-documented.”

For Furrie, 35, many of the claims against him are unfounded, he said.

“I was a kid, I screwed up and did my time and now people want to say all this stuff about me,” said Furrie, who started in the industry in 1998.

Both Harver and Furrie said there will be a strict over-21 policy, with identification checked at the door and at the bar. They added that there have been no problems at the Knox Building since Furrie became involved two weeks ago.

Also, Harver has some financial issues.

He purchased a house in July 2006 at 1748 Midland Ave. in Youngstown with a $16,810 market value, according to the county auditor’s website.

Harver said he used the house, in which he doesn’t live, for a “high-interest equity” loan to help pay to renovate the first Lemon Grove.

Harver hasn’t paid property taxes for a few years on the house, which has a lien on it.

“I’m trying to catch up with debt,” he said. “I never had money in my life. When I first opened the Lemon Grove, we were in the hole. The Midland house wasn’t delinquent at the time [I received the loan]. It’s delinquent now because I am running a business.”

After four years using the Lemon Grove name, Harver said he wants a “fresh branding” of the business and chose the Knox Building because it was the location of an S.H. Knox Co. five-and-dime store that opened in the late 19th century, and was rebuilt in 1909 after a fire destroyed the building.

The store became a Woolworth in 1912 and remained there until 1984. It became a Rite-Aid after that until closing in 1999. It then was an office-supply store, then vacant, then Rosetta Stone from 2007 to 2010, then vacant again until Harver partnered with George Lenahan to open the Lemon Grove.


Comments

1Cmac531(5 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Vindicator writer, why don't you look at your source's court records in Mahoning County at courts.mahoningcountyoh.gov/
Type in Christian Rinehart
Looks like various criminal and civil complaints including a tax lien from the State of Ohio. Is he worthy of having an establishment in downtown Youngstown?

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2republicanRick(1248 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Good and honest business people will not eat at a restaurant run by and for crooks.

Jacob Harver needs to bring in his type of crowds, pot smoking Occupy Youngstown types, and Bob Hagan, his other good friend.

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3author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

What about the Workers Comp Lien against the Lemon Grove LLC filed last October and still not paid? What about the close to ONE MILLION dollars of taxpayers monies given to Rosetta Stone/Lemon Grove/Guy's and now Knox and all they can show for it is 1 person drinking a pop at lunch time?

The bigger question is what government entities let Harver and Lenhan screw the taxpayers and where is the oversite protecting the people's investment?

Mr. Furrie might have a criminal record and maybe he has reformed. Seems to me he is a better risk than Harver.

"I can't pay my taxes because I'm running a business" - great quote from the man who hosts Democrats and Democratic fundraisers all the time.

PS The buildings property taxes are not paid either :(

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4shutyourface(246 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

YOUNGSTOWN

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5sue(173 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Look, it appears that despite his best intentions, this Harver guy does not know how to run a business. Why not sell it and let an established operator take it over.

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6dd933(249 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Most people have a time limit on their lunch and Lemon Grove (at either location by any name) was never able to serve lunch in a timely manner.
The building has great potential but needs work. You could easily put 12-15 residential units in the upper floors. The basement renovation was begun by the Rosetta Stone and never completed. Even the roof has possible commercial value...

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7gobdmn(19 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Ready YPD & YFD!! Brent Furrie is a joke...Just Sayin

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8athena62600(8 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Lemon Grove has never been very quick for lunch so I hope that improves. And if you are a business professional, why eat at a restaurant that you don’t feel welcomed at?

People who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones. Find me a bar that doesn’t have skeletons in the closest! If anyone could get that place fixed, it is Brent. Harver just needs to step back and listen to him. (I just hope Harver hasn’t ruined the place financially to the point of NO return.)

Brent would give someone the shirt right off his back! He may have a history, but if I needed someone to come in and help fix an establishment, I would call Brent. He is great at marketing and has a following.

Good luck Brent!

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9AtownParent(562 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I didn't go to Rumors and don't go to Shotz because of the clientele. Knowing Furrie and his propensity to attract a way younger crowd (not always legal drinkers) at these other two places, Lemon Grove is now off my list as a possible evening destination.

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10Cmac531(5 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

The credit for who wrote this should be given to Christian Rinehart. Is this really newsworthy material or just a bar owner that is using any means possible to eliminate his competition and has two writers that are his puppets. Let me guess.....free lunches for a lifetime at O'Donold's for the two writers of this story?

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11AtownAugie(715 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Might consider naming it after its seemingly best customer : "Hagan's Haunt"

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12maxi(74 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

The Lemon Grove lost its brand, its customer base, and brought in a BBQ menu (sorry, but Charlie Staples is around the corner with that brand). For those of us who enjoyed the original Lemon Grove, the hippy atmosphere, the hodge podge decor, the menu of grilled cheese, omelets, and vegan dishes, we wouldn't consider stepping inside this establishment now. Just the other day my husband and walked on by where before it would have been the first place we walked into.

My husband and I may have hit middle age but we still enjoy our evenings out. And no doubt we have more money to spend than the younger crowd Mr. Harver is now trying to attract. We eat and drink and order more expensive beer, wine, and other alcohol. Not sure the younger crowds will spend what we spend.

We patronize Roberto's, O'Donold's, V2, and Avalon Downtown (love the bar open on weekends...we have a bottle of wine with the best pizza ever). I'm sorry that Lemon Grove lost it's way.

A suggestion for Mr. Harver...think of what you originally created. The brand WAS there. What worked, what didn't? Adjust creatively. Think of the cool hippie atmosphere you had, think late 60s, early 70s, a cosmic time, rock and roll, think of a limited menu with tastey offerings. Visit Lockview in Akron (packed every day of the week!), visit Pub Bricco in Akron, visit Dave's Cosmic Subs in the Cleveland area...they all have the menu and atmosphere. Think tribute bands, something for even baby boomers to listen to (yes, we still go out). Your own neighboring restaurants have a brand. You LOST your brand.

I want this business to succeed. Unfortunately, at this time the forecast is not favorable.

Final note...why another night club?? You're only inviting trouble. Stick with food and good alcohol. They pair well.

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13ricosuave(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Hahaha. Let's move into a building that was rebuilt after a fire consumed it in 1909. I mean, the Rosetta Stone Cafe & Lounge going out of business in 2010 shouldn't impede our plans to open a restaurant business in the same location or throw up any red flags. Doesn't sound haunted or anything.

This has all the makings of a gangster / horror movie with a strong female lead. Youngstown, Gossip Owner, ex-hippie turned entrepreneur turned for-profit gang banger taking out loans on houses he never intends to clean up. MAN!

The way I see it, if they ever turn this into a movie (which they should) - Charlie Staples has to be the protagonist. He has this rack of ribs he carries on his back as he kicks down the door and shoots barbecue sauce in everybody's face. He turns to face the camera. Slow pan.

Staples: "What? Sorry about your door, but did you expect me to KNOX?"

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14burnout(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Thanks to the Vindicator for not just making this piece another PR blurb on Harver/LG. Bets should have been taken on how long Guy's would have stayed in business at the LG's establishment.

The fact that the LG is still open isn't a testament to anything except Harver's adept manipulation of others. It's still frustrating to know how much work and endless hours others, including myself, poured into the business, believing downtown would build up (which it has, and will continue to, despite this) around businesses like the (original) LG. But the only things everyone has to show for all of this work is for naught (well, except for some mild PTSD).

Cooks, bartenders, servers, musicians and artists all gave selflessly to help out what was presented as a common cause, a smart place for downtown to congregate. What was returned was a failed (and failed and failed) business built on one person alone, with his angry rants, slurs, insults, and threats in tow.

Ask local artists who've had paintings and artwork thrown away, broken or otherwise damaged at Harver's hands what they think about this new "evolution." It's not hard to track down an ex-employee who was subject to his late night screaming, ravings. come-ons and misogynistic insults, hurled at loud volume across the bar . Or maybe someone who was fired without cause, told to leave or accused of theft with no evidence. Not to mention fellow business owners, mentors and other local citizens who gave business advice, hours of construction help, donations and financing to help Harver, only to see it turned to his personal bills, a useless expansion or whatever else this dude burned through.

I'm sure he still thinks he's a trailblazer for downtown Youngstown, sacrificing himself first so other businesses could thrive downtown. Get real. Kudos to the new businesses downtown (esp. Avalon Gardens, Roberto's, Downtown Circle and Friends -- well, soon enough) for smartly running bushiness and helping the downtown district actually grow.

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15bmanresident(597 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I used to avoid the Lemon Grove like the plague and now this is another nail in its coffin. The staff at this place makes a non hippy feel like they are interrupting their social hour. God forbid I order something off the menu and not get eyes rolled. Now you bring in Furrie lol. Shut the doors Jacob, you're toast.

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16downtownbartender(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I've heard from several sources (current employees) that Jacob only renamed the bar because he was throwing one of his famous hissy fits. He is angry that he has completely failed as a business owner, and has to hand over the reigns to Brent. Jacob is a bad businessman, a liar, and a snake. hey Jacob, i have one question for you- do you lose sleep at night, knowing that you lied to people in order to meet your kickstarter goal? Not only did you not follow up on the promises of t shirts and free meals for the donors, but you promised them a bar which is nothing like the one you gave them.
Brent is not a bad guy, but he does attract trouble. The Brent that i know is generous and kind, and although he means well, trouble seems to follow him. He has paid for his mistakes, and learned from them, and they need to stop using that to ruin his credibility. The only issue with Brent being downtown, in my opinion, is that his customer base is made up of d-bags and the younger crowd. Bringing this element downtown is sure to affect the other businesses downtown one way or another.
Frankly, i think the partnership of these two is a match made in hell. If the gossip is correct, they have been fighting nonstop, and it's only a matter of time before this partnership dissolves.
meanwhile, i will be right there to watch the fireworks from behind the bar, at a downtown business that will remain long after these flash-in-the-pan nightclubs fizzle out.
Ps- since the lemon grove is such a haven for "artists", you think Jacob could have made that sign look a little more professional? My 4 year old could have done better. Just saying.

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17Ksgirard(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

So nice that after Lemon Grove wrote employees no good checks (several) then didn't even attempt to pay them for hours, this went on 2 different times for months then let these employees go they won't last and those former and current employees need to sue

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18mjusino(15 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Enjoyed that! Thanks, everybody, for the laughs. Seriously, I think we're all on the same page and have been from jump. Too funny...

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19Cmac531(5 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Go to the link below click on violations and look up permit 0574931
https://www.comapps.ohio.gov/liqr/liq...

Christian from O'donold's shouldn't throw rocks from a glass house, especially a glass house with this many cracks....see for yourself, wow!! Maybe he should send the city an email warning them about himself!! Out of curiosity Christian do you have any partners at either of your locations that have previously been convicted of a felony????

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20Cmac531(5 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Sparky, nope wasn't me at the Knox, but I smell a rat when I see one. Christian from O'Donald's thought he was gonna stay behind the scenes on this one and cause another business all kinds of problems. I have to thank the writers for exposing him for what he is!! Can't wait to see the whole email to the city which is public record....I hope the brilliant Christian didn't set himself up for a Libel lawsuit...on the other hand I hope he did!!

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21southsidedave(4840 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Third time is the charm...maybe?

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22author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Harver's direct quote "I never had any money in my life". When he applied for (and received) $25,000.00 in taxpayers money via a CDBG his budget shows State and Local Government investments of $101,632.00 and private equity of $80,000.00. He said he was using the $25,000 to help offset the costs of renovations $103,000.00,Capital Equipment $65,000, Payroll ($7.75 per employee)=$12,632, Inventory $10,000 and rent $13,000.00.

From Harver's original application: Scope of work - "The Lemon Grove and Lounge has already created 21 additional jobs in downtown. More employees will be added as the business continues to grow."

Don't blame Harver amd Lenahan for being bandits. They saw they could pull the wool over the politicians, Youngstown Muni Loan fund, Huntington Bank, MEDVEC heads and they did.

Blame the people who give YOUR money away to their friends while the neighborhoods are being shot up.

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23Bozley13(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I think people are forgetting all of the charity work Jacob has done in Y-Town. Also, wasn't Brent recently mentioned in the Boardman newspaper for domestic violence?

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24bmanresident(597 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Charity? How about all the suckers that donated money to him to move the restaurant? He's a lying crook!

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25Cubbies(37 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I was always told he was not making money in the original location. What made him think he was going to make money in a bigger location?

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26kurtw(937 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

What would save Harver, and be a downtown sensation, would be if he had a video of Bobbie Hagan getting the crap beat out of him. I would pay to see that- I think a lot of people would.

As for the new manager having a felony record, I think if you shut down every restaurant and tavern in Y-town operated by someone with a record- or mob connections- a lot more of us would be eating home cooking.

P.S. I went once or twice into the old Lemon Grove- didn't like it at all- the Cedars was much better- and I didn't particularly care for the Cedars.

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27kurtw(937 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

The only way to be successful running a tavern or restaurant is offering good food, fairly priced, in friendly surroundings- the drinks are a given- everybody with a liquor license sells them.

A good example of a friendly, family orientated restaurant that's highly successful- and there are many examples- would be Davidson's in Austintown. I stop there sometimes to have a beer (or two) and it's a nice place to go, relaxing, no loud music, no rowdyism- just pleasant. Those are the kinds of places that do well in the long run (the place mentioned in your story, "Shotz" is the kind of place I try to avoid at all costs. I was there once and couldn't wait to leave- seedy, run-down, noisy- with customers that looked as if they belonged on a chain gang!)

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28Christianisahypocrate(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I'm sorry but who is Christian Rhinehart to talk about anyone?? I can remember when Christian's father Donold died and a man named Mike Quinlan stepped up and took care of him and his brother Teddy! Fronted Christian the money to open Austintown ODonold's under the terms that Christian would pay him back after opening and becoming profitable. Does anyone know where this money went? Up his nose! Christians own brother Teddy went to prison himself! Christian ripped off every contractor who built Austintown to the point that in order to do any work in youngstown, he first had to pay cash up front. And let's talk about Niles O'Donolds (Now Quinlan's Irish Pub) Christian sued Mike Quinlan for the name O'Donolds and stole it right out from underneath Mike after all Mike did for him and his mother when his father died! Christian is known for ripping everyone off from employees to contractors and yet he's pointing fingers? For anyone interested, here is the countless charges against Christian, excluding the ones he's paid to have expunged. This guy is not in a position to talk about anyone.

http://courts.mahoningcountyoh.gov/pa...

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29Christianisahypocrate(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Search Criteria
Last Name: RINEHART; First Name: CHRISTIAN;
Search Results
13 record(s) found.
1-13 of 13 Sort Results..
Party Affl Party Type D.O.B Case Status Case Number
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN OT CLOSED 50 2011 CR B 00628 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN 3PD CLOSED 50 2011 CV 00304
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN 3PD CLOSED 50 2011 CV 00304
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN DFNDT CLOSED 50 2011 CV 01327
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT 03/07/1975 CLOSED 50 1997 TR D 00104 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT 03/07/1975 CLOSED 50 2001 CR B 00896 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT 03/07/1975 CLOSED 50 2007 TR D 02853 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2011 CV 00493
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT 03/07/1975 CLOSED 50 2012 CR B 00312 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT 03/07/1975 CLOSED 50 2012 CR B 00313 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DBTR OPEN 50 2012 TL 01858
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2013 CV 00978
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN R DFNDT CLOSED 50 2008 CV 02788

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30bmanresident(597 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@ RK330 LOLOLOLOLOLOL!

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31author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Stay focused. Christian and Brent are not the problems. It is the elected and appointed officials, MEDVEC, Huntington Bank and the Youngstown Muni Loan Fund that needs to be investigated for giving the banditos Lemon Grove (Lenahan/Harver) hundreds of thousands of dollars with no accountability while the city is shot to pieces.

From Harver's CDBG application: 'the money I receive from the government will be used to opening the Lemon Grove which will provide jobs to low-moderate income individuals directly and provide economic benefit to local artists and other local businesses through its entertainment and its policy of buy local first. The criteria its success will be judged by will be the creation of 7 low-moderate income jobs over the first year of operation demonstrating that the Lemon Grove buys local whenever if it is feasible by the printing of a BUY YOUNGSTOWN quarterly detailing our role in a vibrant community of businesses.'

MORE TO COME!

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32blkpride(186 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Christian has a great product with O'Donald's that stands out! V2 another great venue! Roberto's and Avalon two more great businesses! We want more like this. Enough said, Brent and Chris. We do not want or need another kiddie bar downtown causing problems and that is what you are offering. Quit blaming others for your past mistakes. Chris and Brent, you sound like petulant children by attacking Christian. This is what you are offering with club Knox and it is not welcome here. Go set up shop somewhere else or find a better product to that does not attract a bad element. Then there would be no issue. This is the concern of many not just one person. If the city is going to allow the owners of Knox to set up another puppy mill and chase away all of the good patrons, they can't say they were not warned.

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33FORtheTARDS(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

lol this shows that he knows brent WILL take all of his night business.. go eat lunch at odonalds then hop on over and have a drink at the old LG at night!! hahahhha

In an Aug. 6 email to Mayor Charles Sammarone and Police Chief Rod Foley, Christian Rinehart, owner of O’Donold’s Irish Pub at 122 W. Federal St. [the original location of the Lemon Grove], wrote that after making a significant investment in downtown he “believed it necessary to put a stop” to any involvement Furrie might have with the Knox Building’s business operations.

“You can understand I’m not against the Lemon Grove, or a good operation coming in,” Rinehart wrote, “but one [incident] can end anything we as a group have accomplished in the downtown Youngstown area.”

Rinehart is scared hahhhahhaaaaaa

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34FORtheTARDS(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

and why not worry about the school up the street that has less and less people in it every year...or the fact that 2 students got mugged at SCHOOL today NOT DOWNTOWN.....durrrr

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35FORtheTARDS(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Last Name: RINEHART; First Name: CHRISTIAN;
Search Results

13 record(s) found.
1-13 of 13 Sort Results..
Party Affl Party Type D.O.B Case Status Case Number
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN OT CLOSED 50 2011 CR B 00628 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN 3PD CLOSED 50 2011 CV 00304
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN 3PD CLOSED 50 2011 CV 00304
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN DFNDT CLOSED 50 2011 CV 01327
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 1997 TR D 00104 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2001 CR B 00896 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2007 TR D 02853 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2011 CV 00493
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2012 CR B 00312 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2012 CR B 00313 AUS
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DBTR OPEN 50 2012 TL 01858
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN D DFNDT CLOSED 50 2013 CV 00978
RINEHART, CHRISTIAN R DFNDT CLOSED 50 2008 CV 02788

AND THAT IS JUST MAHONING COUNTY PUBLIC RECORDS....what a hypocrite..

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36author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

From Harver's CDBG application;

'Should the Lemon Grove or its support of other local businesses prove ineffective, we will evaluate how we can remedy the situation and discuss with other businesses what we can do better to ensure our mutual success.'

Banditos Lemon Grove (Lenahan and Harver) were given thousands of taxpayers money from YOUR elected/appointed officials and ALL need to be exposed and held accountable.

MORE TO COME;

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37Shamrock29(20 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

When life hands you a Lemon Grove..hire Brett Furrie???
I gave up on this establishment long ago because the writing has been on the wall since inception of this colossal failure. Harver's attempt to succeed in business by attracting a type of crowd that typically doesn't succeed in life, well that's just career suicide. I mean..when Bob Hagan gets his coat dusted for asking some thugs Auntie to please sit down doesn't define what type of place this is.. then I don't know what does. Now Brett Furrie gets brought in to try and save it?? Brett rides on his daddy's coat tails. He just likes to tell the young girls that he "owns" the place. Then he drives around picking up his patrons from the local police stations after they've been picked up for DUI. Shame on Youngstown for letting this happen.

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38Cubbies(37 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

This is by far been the best comments section on any Vindy story! Keep it up!

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39author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

From Harver's CDBG application:

"Though the Lemon Grove is a for profit café, it is unique from other ventures in its core philosophy. Unlike the traditional rationale "business solely for the sake of profit," the Lemon Grove operates under the mantra "business for profit of the better good."

Banditos Lemon Grove (Lenahan/Harver) used this mantra to get hundreds of thousands of YOUR tax payers dollars from elected/appointed officials who must be held accountable.

MORE TO COME:

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40blkpride(186 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Brent, aka forthetards, LG KNOX is a hole. Bashing Christian will still make it a hole operated by a hole. This is not about Christian it is about LG and the type if business that will continue to operate there. Quit trying to deflect and redirect.

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41HSG(139 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

"is Cinderella sweeping up on Desolation Row..."

So, who is Mr. Harver, and why is he entitled to so many opportunities to fail?

If, indeed, he has received public funds and has failed to use those funds in a successful manner, the faucet should be turned off on this process.

If his vision of downtown is based on the promotion of underage drinking, as suggested in a recent hire, his judgement must not be especially clear.

Perhaps it is time to fold this venture completely and then option the property to professional, experienced, intuitive people who can provide and sustain a spot like the Lemon Grove.

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42shutyourface(246 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Cubbies I couldn't agree more...........Please keep these comments coming don't stop this is good stuff!

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43republicanRick(1248 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Jacob Harver and his flaming failures are what happen when you let a socialist try to run a business. They do not understand how capitalism works and therefore fail miserably when they step into the business arena.

Jacob should do what he does best and that is selling tie-dye t-shirts and hydroponic equipment and join the anti-fracking crowd.

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44Roger_Thornhill(624 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

First time I went to the Lemon Grove, I thought it was neat atmosphere with limited menu and not so good value or service.

Second time, same thing. Then I read about Harver and his protests against banks that were funding him. That was ridiculous. And how the place became Bob Hagan's personal hang out.

Third time, I went some place else.

After reading the comments that have been posted above, I won't be going to either of the dueling eateries.

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45ytownfacts(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

OK NOW WAIT A MINUTE HERE. FOR STARTERS, IF WE'RE GOING TO BLAST ONE LETS BE FAIR AND BLAST ALL. GO DOWN FEDERAL STREET AND I GUARANTEE YOU WILL FIND AT LEAST ONE FELON OR EX-CON WORKING SOMEWHERE IN THAT ESTABLISHMENT. WHETHER IT BE IN THE KITCHEN ON THE BAR OR IN MANAGEMENT I AM CERTAIN I CAN FIND AT LEAST ONE IN EVERY ESTABLISHMENT. HOW IS IT FAIR THAT CHRISTIAN RINEHART OF ALL PEOPLE CAN SEND OUT LETTERS TO EVERYONE IN THE CITY EXPOSING BRENT FOR HIS PAST? I PERSONALLY DO NOT KNOW BRENT, I ONLY KNOW OF HIM JUST AS MOST OF YOU DO YET YOU JUMP TO CRITICIZE. STARTING WITH CHRISTIAN. THIS MAN HAS HAD A FORMER FELON AS HIS BUSINESS PARTNER WHO SO HAPPENS TO BE HIS BROTHER. IT IS NO SECRET THAT CHRISTIAN IS NOTORIOUS FOR RIPPING PEOPLE OFF FINANCIALLY JUST AS ITS NO SECRET HE HAD BATTLED A DRUG PROBLEM THROUGH THE YEARS WHICH EXPLAINS HIS EXTREME WEIGHT FLUCTUATION. NOW TO LIQUID BLU. IT IS ALSO COMMON KNOWLEDGE THAT ONE OF THE MEN RUNNING THE BAR MORE BEHIND THE SCENES IS ALSO A CONVICTED FELON WHO JUST RECENTLY GOT OUT OF PRISON THIS PAST YEAR. SO I WONDER WHY IT IS CHRISTIAN FELT A NEED TO TARGET BRENT BUT NOT THIS OTHER ESTABLISHMENT. IT SEEMS PRETTY OBVIOUS TO ME THAT CHRISTIAN IS INTIMIDATED BY BRENT BC IF THERE IN ANYTHING WE KNOW OF BRENT ON THE FOREFRONT ITS THAT HE IS AN AWESOME PROMOTER. NOW LETS MOVE DOWN TO WAREHOUSE 50/FORMERLY DOONEY'S DOWNTOWN BAR & GRILLE. WHEN DOONEY'S FIRST CAME TO TOWN WE ALL KNEW THEIR DEMISE WAS INEVITABLE. NOW IN GOING WITH THE THEME AND CALLING A SPADE A SPADE WE ALL KNEW DOONEY'S WAS NAMED AFTER THE MAYOR'S BROTHER AND THE OWNER OF DOONEYS UNCLE. DOONEY WAS A KNOWN HIT MAN WITH EXTENSIVE MOB CONNECTIONS. THAT WAS THE MAIN REASON THE BAR COULDN'T SURVIVE. NO LOCAL YTOWN BUSINESS WAS GOING TO INC WITH OR SUPPORT AN ESTABLISHMENT THAT CARRIED SUCH A STIGMA WITH IT. AND HOW ARROGANT WAS CHRIS TO THINK HE COULD ACTUALLY NAME A BAR AFTER THIS GUY? FAILURE. IN WALKS A YOUNG GENTLEMEN BY THE NAME OF RYAN REESE. NOW IN A FAILED ATTEMPT TO PUT ON A FAKE FACADE THAT CHRIS IS NO LONGER A BUSINESS OWNER HE PUTS RYAN AS THE FACE OF THE NEWLY NAMED ESTABLISHMENT BUT WE ALL KNOW THAT CHRIS AND RYAN ARE PARTNERS. YOU CANT FOOL THE PEOPLE OF YOUNGSTOWN. NOW LETS FLASHBACK FOR A MOMENT TO 2007 WHEN RYAN REESE AND HIS BROTHERS TRIED SUING THE COVELLI CENTER AFTER AN ALTERCATION WITH POLICE AT THE KELLY PAVLIK FIGHT. THIS IS A PERSON WHO CERTAINLY NEEDS TO HAVE HIS CREDIBILITY QUESTIONED AS WELL. SOMEONE WHO INSTANTLY CREATED A NEGATIVE STIGMA FOR HIMSELF AND HIS BAR THE MINUTE HE CALLED HIMSELF "THE CHAMP" OF YOUNGSTOWN. HE DID SO TO THE EXTENT THAT HIS OWN MANAGEMENT TEAM HAD TO WALK BAR TO BAR ON FEDERAL APOLOGIZING FOR HIS RUDE BEHAVIOR AND REMARKS. THIS IS A GUY WHO IS KNOWN IN HIS HOMETOWN OF AUSTINTOWN AS A FAKE, PHONY, FRAUD AND THIEF.

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46ytownfacts(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

JUST AS ONE PERSON MAY HAVE THEIR FAULTS AND SECRETS SO DO THE OTHERS. IT IS WRONG FOR ANY ONE OF US TO BROADCAST AND COMMENT ON SOMETHING BRENT DID OVER TEN YEARS AGO WHEN THERE IS SOMETHING TO BE SAID ABOUT ALMOST EVERY BAR OWNER OR THE ESTABLISHMENT ITSELF ON FEDERAL STREET. WANT SOME PROOF? CHECK OUT THESE WEBSITES

http://courts.co.trumbull.oh.us/eserv...

LOOK UP CHRISTIAN RINEHART AND THEODORE RINEHART.

http://www4.vindy.com/content/local_r...
HERE IS THE ARTICLE ABOUT THE NEW WAREHOUSE50 OWNER SUING

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47MR330(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

well said ytown facts! so this brent guy that serves the underage babies everyone speaks of? would this be the SAME brent that you see standing outside almost every night asking for proper identification and wrist-banding people? The same one that turns away anyone under 21? Yeah thats what I thought. No one underage is getting served here. stop bringing up past mistakes people. Live in the now!

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48REALLY_CHRISTIAN(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Good thing Christian cannot start to "report" people on here like he is doing on Facebook so that noone can speak the truth about him and their accounts are unable to post for 12+ hours.

“You can understand I’m not against the Lemon Grove, or a good operation coming in,” Rinehart wrote, “but one [incident] can end anything we as a group have accomplished in the downtown Youngstown area.”

HEY CHRISTIAN.. remember the "INCIDENT" at the Austintown O'donalds when one of your "bouncers" PUNCHED a FEMALE in the face in the back and there was nothing done about it and you guys threatened her that if she called the police that SHE would be the one in trouble for underage and some other thing? Hmm, must not ring a bell because anytime someone brings it up you report it so it gets taken down. Maybe the Vindicator should post all the pictures of the under age girls being served at your bar. I PERSONALLY have quite a few of MYSELF drinking in your bars while still in high school.

Christian thinks he's top notch with running/owning a bar. Lets be real here, O'donalds has only been downtown a year, IF that, lets see how long it really lasts. And O'donald's in Austintown only does good on St. Patrick's day!

And lastly, if people are going to complain about bringing in a "younger crowd" NOONE IN THEIR 40S WANTS TO BE DOWNTOWN, and CLEARLY the two Joe's at N9NE know what they are doing because they have been down there the longest out of ANY bars so maybe everyone could walk their happy little asses over to them and take a few pointers.

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49Cubbies(37 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

A man walks into the Lemon Grove/Knox building carrying a gas can, some oily rags, and a box of matches and sits down at the bar. The bartender walks up to the man, gives him a strange look, and says "you're late".

Badda bing!

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50athena62600(8 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I’m surprised that with all the bashing about the type of crowd Brent brings downtown, only 1 person brought up Liquid Blu. I’d take Brent’s crowd over the Jersey Shore Juiceheads and Golddiggers Liquid Blu attracts anyday.

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51author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

From Harver's CDBG application:

"The Lemon Grove also fills a great need for quality late night food. We will be open nightly until 4am. Currently there are no restaurants within the city limits, besides taco bell, that stays open late. Not only does this provide convenience to those patronizing downtown bars but it also is a matter of safety in that they will not have to drive under the influence out to the suburbs to Denny's or Perkins for a place to sober up.'

And with this drivel, elected and appointed officials gave Banditos Lemon Grove (Lenahan/Harver) hundreds of thousands of tax payer's dollars.

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52REALLY_CHRISTIAN(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Now I know where to eat instead of the crappy gyros at the convenient store. One more reason to not step foot back into O'donalds and give that rolly poly of a man anymore money.

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53MR330(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

and its people like @cubbies that fuel the smear campaign of one individual. why not give brent a chance downtown to see how he acts in the present instead of making accusations regarding his past??????

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54Cubbies(37 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Never thought I would see the day when downtown merchants would miss Lucky Penny.

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55author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

More from Harver's CDBG application:

'The Lemon Grove will be seeking out investors to make up any difference in the $25,000.00 requested and that which is received in the grant. The investor's program will consider any investment a loan that will be paid with interest to the investor. Ideally the full $25,000.00 would be granted as it is necessary to our opening, and attracting investors in this economic climate is quite formidable task that as of yet proven unsuccessful.'

President Obama was Harver's first investor as he pumped $25,000 of stimulus money into this place.

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56karma81(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Wow all I can say is after reading all of these comments one thing is clear... people are extremely threatened by Brent!!! Repeatedly bringing up his past just shows how unforgiving and judgmental people can be. This is someone who has paid his debt to society. Someone who has gone above and beyond in his community to organize benefits and functions for those in need. Most importantly, it's someone who now has a family to support and is just trying to start over like we all are. Everyday is a chance to start a new life and live in a new way and he chose that path many years ago. Leave this man alone and let him live his life. Above all else, be careful people.... "Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone!!"

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57ytownbars(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

What people are saying about Jacob may be true but what does that have to do with Brent? He just came into this business and is trying to turn it around. Judging from the past two weekends alone, I think he's doing a great job! Keep it up Brent, Youngstown loves you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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58city_resident(513 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

"Geeeeez. Why would anyone go downtown. Just go to Boardman. Slightly safer. Better food. Better atmosphere. Far less homeless trash."

Hmm, I prefer downtown for the better food, and for the better atmosphere. I think downtown is safer, too. I will admit that there are more panhandlers downtown, though.

Now back to our regularly scheduled Lemon Grove bashing/who is the bigger felon contest.

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59author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

From Harver's CDBG application:

'Many of those we hire to work at the Lemon Grove will be artists. Not only does this provide a cultural benefit to Youngstown, but as the vast majority of artists fall into the struggling category it serves the job creation of low-moderate income individuals.'

Elected/appointed government type read this BS and gave him the key to the city vault!

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60Falcorchad(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Glad to see the liberal agenda take a hit. Maybe the people of this area are starting to realize being a broke wanna-be hippie isn't cool anymore. Having a job, taking care of your responsibility, and paying your fair share is cool. Vote Republican and change this corrupt downtrodden town.

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61OhReally1(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I cannot believe the amount of disillusioned patrons that are posting praises on other bars in the downtown area. Are you serious?! All you over 40 something people aren't at these bars after 11:00 p.m. to witness the debauchery and trash that comes and goes. How about the bars that are owned cokeheads who come out of the back room with a slew of people rubbing their noses and making sure they're "cool". How about all the terrible service?! the bartenders at O'Donalds downtown are by far the rudest most incompetent bartenders of all. Anyone can pour a beer from a tap but when someone orders a shot of a liquor that states right on the bottle "best served chilled" and isn't handed a chilled shot then gets an ATTITUDE from the bartender for requesting it chilled-you just lost a customer. I used to bartender and its not hard. Not to mention the rude YOUNG crowd that overpacks the tiny bar after 11. Rhinehart is clearly just worried of losing his usual frat kid, loud, obnoxious and moronic customer base.
On the subject of customers, I see underage people drinking at all of the establishments downtown which is why I HATE going out downtown! I am an adult and do not appreciate getting slammed into by out of control, wasted children slurring their words and spilling their drinks everywhere. Sure maybe that was once me, but I knew where to go and let me tell you... When I was underage I got served at the original O'Donald's in Austintown-that's the whole reason I went there! Haha unreal!
And shame on the vindicator for allowing whoever wrote this to pull skeletons out of peoples' closets. Those facts about the pasts of people have absolutely no business in an article about a bar changing hands again. What exactly was the point of this article? It wasn't to VINDICATE anyone that's for sure. It actually did the opposite! Maybe the vindicator should start reporting actual news instead of pointless suspicions about whether or not a business owner made a good or bad move. That's not news-it's gossip-then further more printing someone's criminal record from almost ten years ago is just creating unnessecary judgements made by people who don't really know the person. this whole article actually negates the whole meaning of the word VINDICATE. Perhaps the Vindicator needs to start writing news worthy vindicating stories or at least change the name of the paper.

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62where(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Not even gonna get into Jacob's business sense. He lacked some skills, everyone does. He had an almost unbelievable amount of support getting that place up and running to make up for his shortcomings.

..and then he fired them, one by one, once he was done using them. Whatever, his business, his call to make.

My problem with him is that simply firing people during one of his fits isn't good enough for him. He goes out of his way to weave elaborate lies about why they were fired. Potentially long term, damaging lies, just to save some face. He's gone far enough with his delusions to actually get the courts and other agencies involved until he eventually gives up because he knows he doesn't have a leg to stand on. That makes him a disturbing individual.

burnout also mentioned how horribly he treated local artists. Not only did he allow their works to be destroyed, sometimes he would just hold the pieces hostage, rotting away in his basement, for no reason other than...well, because he could, I guess?

He's been doing a it does years. It's no wonder he's finally alienated enough of his target market to be forced to change gears. Everyone who had even the slightest involvement with him besides eating or drinking there has at least one horror story about Jacob.

He got by with his initial market for longer than he deserved because they would still come downtown for some other event, then get drunk enough to stand his bar for nostalgia's sake.

But now, there is next to nothing to draw that crowd downtown and hope that they'll stumble into his bar. He has no choice but to turn it into something that leaches off the other 'clubs' if he has any hope of digging himself out of the hole he dug.

As much as I dislike the man, I'm sad it turned out this way. Him losing control was inevitable, but I always hoped someone more sane with the same vision would pick up the ball. He stretched his power trip way too long, and it is 100% his fault that his idea wasn't sustained.

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63karma81(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Sparky... I don't doubt that you have extensive knowledge about Jacob and his prior actions in regards to running the lemon grove based on your previous posts. I agree with you that Jacob should not be in the bar business. Whats upsetting is that Brent has come downtown, promoting this bar and trying to successfully turn it around and the words of one man who chose to contact the newspaper, have slandered him based on his past. Christian Rinehart is a scumball and that is the consensus of anyone that knows him. The Vindicator should be ashamed for printing such garbage and allowing this kind of slander to circulate at their hands. The point of a newspaper is supposed to report actual news. Maybe there was an actual cause to print an article about the lemon grove once again changing hands but to outright put someone's criminal record out in the open for everyone to see is just plain wrong. What kind of society are we as a whole to persecute an individual based on their past mistakes? Everyone has skeletons in their closet, some worse than others, but in the end who are we to judge? Those pointing fingers or taking part in this comical slandering of someone are no better than the one they are putting on display. The entire situation is shameful and I wish Brent all the best. We as a community should be working together and rallying around Brent instead of trying to condemn him. I don't know him personally, I only know of him but regardless no one deserves to have done to them what Christian just did to him. I will never step foot into O'Donalds again because I refuse to patronize a business that feels the need to eliminate his competition by hitting below the belt!

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64where(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

an by the way, i don't know the owners of O'Donold's or this Brent guy, doubt I've ever been to any of their establishments, but I followed the comments links to their court records. Since when are a noise ordinance conviction and some traffic tickets (the Rinehart's) even comparable to multiple assault charges (Brent Furrie)?

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65jessica78(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Awwwww mannnnn... I'm just soooooo torn up about those who have recently found their pretentious hipster identity within the last couple months by being a bartender there!!!! what's gonna happen! I'm so concerned about these hipsters that have nowhere to go! I should start a non profit pretentious hipster fund and let's not forget about the "musicians" who put themselves on a pedestal over other people. Because GODD FORBID us commoners don't know how to play an instrument!!!

Are people gonna have to go back to bagging groceries? Fall into a depression??????? But wait they're so much better than us because they hang out at The Lemon Grove with a Bachelor's degree. WHERE WILL THEY GO!!!!????????????????

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66thatguy1979(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I just wanna know how much christian paid to have the guys at the vindicator write such a bs article? Maybe he just blew them or offered them free lunch for life from his filthy kitchen. Hes just mad that hes old, fat again, bald and past his prime. Maybe he can leave his bars to his felon brother. This chubby chaser is past his prime for real. Bring on Brent Furrie!!!!!!!

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67thatguy1979(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@where... If you look at the records in trumbull county you can see where one of his cases is "request for expungement" He chose to have his major charges on his record sealed. Brent doesnt hide who he is so props to him

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68karma81(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Sparky I could agree with you about forgiving Christian Rineharts past as everyone elses but my issue with it at this point is the fact that he would have the balls to put Brents past on blast the way he did knowing full well what his own past is. If Christian didn't abuse the media and the ignorant writers of the article refused to publish it, Christian's past wouldn't be getting talked about right now. He started this and brought it all on himself. It's just plain wrong. Everyone needs to put the gloves away and make room for all.

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69OhReally1(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

that's exactly what I was saying @Sparky! THE REAL PROBLEM HERE IS THAT THIS IDIOTIC STORY BASHING PEOPLE'S PASTS WAS EVER WRITTEN IN THE FIRST PLACE! I'M SURE THE AUTHOR HAD TO LOOK UP WHAT THE WORD VINDICATE EVEN MEANS! SO DUMB.

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70OhReally1(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

AND @KARMA WELL SAID. THE VINDICATOR IS A JOKE. THIS IS NOT THE FIRST STORY I'VE READ RELEASING UNNECESSARY DETAILS ABOUT SOMEONE'S PERSONAL LIFE THAT HAS NO RELATION TO THE ORIGINAL STORY. WHAT IS THE POINT? THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE A NEWS PAPER, NOT A DRAMA FILLED RUMOR MILL. ABUSE OF THE MEDIA AS USUAL.

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71Cubbies(37 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Man, this is better than watching the real housewives of New Jersey.

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72bubbagumps(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

If there's anything that I can agree with in all these comments it's that both the lemon grove and odonolds need new bartenders. The bartenders at odonolds are the worst, don't ever ask them to go above and beyond to make sure you get the drink you're paying for the way you want it! I have been in there many times and the bartenders lack patience and are very snippy and rude. After reading something as vile as this article and seeing what one business owner did to another, I definitely will not support this establishment again. I will give a shoutout though to the one bartender rugby chick at odonolds because she's always been on her game and with a smile. As for the lemon grove, they need to come down a few notches off their high horses and realize their pretentious attitude and lack of bar experience does not make anyone want to tip them well, if at all. They are a staff that looks miserable doing their job. Now in also giving the lemon grove a compliment I will say I was in there last weekend with some friends and the "new" bar staff is much friendlier, competent, and way faster. I think changes need to be made in both bars and Brent definitely has the lemon grove on a better track. Just hope it stays that way and continues to get better.

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73where(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

whatever, i'll take either of their criminal records over Jacob Harver any day. It might not be public record, but he has maliciously or delusionally screwed over way too many people for to think it could get any worse.

@jessica78: He's doing the future employees a favor with the re-branding. A very good friend of mine worked there for almost two years (gotta be a record) during college before being fired during one of his "it's everyone else's fault" fits. This individual was given a courtesy tip by another business owner, after being denied employment, to not put the Lemon Grove down as a previous employer because the place had such a bad stigma in the community.

This is absolutely not my only knowledge of his practices, i've witnessed plenty more first-hand through out the years, but it seemed relevant.

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74JR_0960(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I had no idea that the vindicator was so desperate for patrons that it had to behave like the weekly world news or some other sensationalist rag and flaunt the failings of multiple people for the general public. Whatever ineptitude has gone on, I don't believe it was intended or performed maliciously. Certainly no additional public money should be sent in that direction, but with a little perspective, arguably the government wastes massive amounts of money on all sorts of failing ventures, why have a witch hunt on a local person that was clever enough to pen and probably believe in that idealistic grant proposal. The newspaper needs to report on the wars we are in currently and the true state of things rather than distract readers with juicy local gossip. For shame, be a bastion of truth and enlightenment rather than a tawdry gossip rag. Boo

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75where(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@jr_0960

"a local person that was clever enough to pen and probably believe in that idealistic grant proposal"

HA

If you think Mr. Harver wrote those proposals, or that the person that did it for him for free wasn't burned at his stake by the time the year turned, you are very mistaken.

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76ytownfartmonkey(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I read about half of these comments and then stopped after realizing they are basically all the same. It is very sad to read all of the negative comments from people who are more or less happy that this guy is failing. Why would anybody want to see anyone fail? Come on people. If you don't like the person or the establishment, just don't go there and leave it alone. No need to want it to fail, it just may not be the place for you. The negativity on here is shameful.

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77author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

From Harver's CDBG application:

We plan to have at least seven of these jobs created to be filled by low-moderate income individuals. This will be documented by their 2008 tax returns. At least 5 of these individuals will be residents of Youngstown, this can be documented by their mailing address.'

When I requested the underwriting guidelines and follow up documentation from the elected/appointed officials about how they could fork over $25,000.00 on the BS Harver wrote on his application, I received a letter from the largest law firm in the city, saying they WILL not comply.

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78Bozley13(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Some crimes committed are somewhat forgivable. I know Brent had many charges from when he was younger-understandable. What is not understandable was that the Boardman police were called to Akron Children's Hospital because Brent assaulted his girlfriend-the mother of his child. THAT was this summer.

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79blkpride(186 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@author50, isn't that public record? They have to comply and will. Just have to submit the fo to the law department in writting.

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80blkpride(186 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@author50, isn't that public record? They have to comply and will. Just have to submit the fo to the law department in writting.

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81author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@bikpride. According to the law firm hired by MEDVEC they do not have to comply. You give me $10,000.00 to file a mandamus action and I will be glad to have you as a partner :)

Mahoning County Auditor website: Parcel ID 53002A073000 110 W Federal Street, Owner info: 110 West LLC (George Lenahan/Jacob Harver).

Annual taxes: $4,207.99
Taxes paid: $200
Delinquent taxes ZERO????

A call down to Yemma's office and I was told that the city of Youngstown granted the Lemon Grove property tax abatements to help it "prosper". Next time Harver screams about the 1% not getting their fair share, remind him how he is screwing the kids in the school system. Next time Sammarone, Sweirz, Tito, Demain, Mike, Janet and the other council members scream about the poor quality of education in Youngstown, remind them about the Lemon Grove tax abatement didn't help the schools and the kids that they themselves granted.

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82republicanRick(1248 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Great undercover work and background work. Why can't the Vindicator uncover these public facts? Oh that's right, they just hire stenographers and not actual, old fashion reporters.

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83blkpride(186 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@bubbagumps you sound like one of those customers who will complain about anything unless you get a reach around for your patronage. I have alway had excellent service an any issues with service have ALWAYS been rectified.

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84kristi32(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

THis story makes me sick!!!! and it also doesnt seem to phase me that Christian Reinharts name is all over this!!!
Brent Furrie may have past well lets face it we all do but Chirtian has one as well has anybody googled him or his brother Ted? yes they have Odonalds who cares the warren Odonalds was raided how many times for under age drinking? Numerous while i was there the crowd there ya not the best! which is why he pulled out of the warren location and opened Austintown and lets face it what does Austintown Odonalds do for the community besides the Fred Perry bike Run? Nothing!! They have been contacted to do fundrasiers for the community and have flat out said no or just not returned calls, Great way to conduct business Mr. Reinhart way to go!!! Reinharts only concern is that since the Lemon Gorve is launching a new face that he will loose business and i personally will never give him a dime of my money ever again!!
I dont appreciate seeing this as a lets bash Brent Furrie campaign, Brent was there when Joe Kalza was shot and set up funstions to raise money for the family to have a wheel chair access for him, what did Christian do yep nothing!! How about when a small child needed a special dog to help with his care who ended up passing away the beginning of this year onec again Brent helped the family with functions and fundraising to help the family get the dog and with medical bills even paying mostly out of pocket for all auctions they have had where was Christian? exactly no where to be seen. Maybe if Christian was a better person and more active in the community he would not care about another business coming into the area with better owners and a better atmosphere then the lame Odonald where you can only get half cooked or over cooked food watered down drinks and deal with sports on every channel! LAME !!
Evrybody who has recently attended the relaunch of The Lemon Grove loves the atmosphera the owners actually being there and out meeting and greeting the customers it is strickly 21 and over and it is a great evening out with friends.

The owners of the Lemon Grove have a private life and we cant fault them for that everybody has a life but until the Lemon Grove disappoints customers with Brent working his magic then lets not run a slander campaign against him!

Lets put all the focus on the Reinhart boys and all their dirty little secrets that they have tried to hide and even run from

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85republicanRick(1248 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

kristi32 were you drunk when you wrote the illegible diatribe above or just too lazy or stupid to put sentences together with proper spelling, grammar, etc?
That letter is embarrassing.

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86DwightK(1300 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

How hard is it to run a restaurant catering to the lunch crowd? Move people in and out and cook fast. If you can't do that by the time you get to your 3rd name you may want to do something else for a living.

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87knox(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

BOZLEY13-- Why don't you post a THIRD comment and try yet again to bring up Brent's personal relationship with his fiance? There is no record of your accusations on file so stop trying to call attention to your worthless claims. Brent and his fiance are perfectly happy raising their gorgeous baby boy. Find something worth talking about instead of posting the same comment every few hours. You seem to be someone with a personal agenda for Brent and all it does it make you look bored and pathetic. Get a life.

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88author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

On 03.19.2012 the Rosetta Stone Group LLC (George Lenahan) transferred the liquor license to Lemon Grove LLC dba Lemon 110 West LLC (Jacob Harver & George Lenahan).

The license was in the hands of the bankruptcy court and a trustee.

What was the price of the license? What creditors were paid from the aforementioned (and there were hundreds).

Rumors are that Councilman Mike Ray was involved in helping this move swiftly through the system at a fraction of the cost.

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89blkpride(186 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@kristi32 odonalds DOES do benefits and fundraisers. Where is it written that any business has to donate or provide a charity service. Business already pay more than their fair share in taxes to pay for this entitlement society we live in. It is the choice of the business not @kristi32

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90XL(18 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Facinating! Are the flames an omen of things to come?

https://www.facebook.com/events/16809...

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91spookybartender(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

think this whole article was poorly done, and was only printed to stir up trouble between business owners downtown. Everyone involved with this article looks awful in the light that the vindicator has painted them- they made Brent out to be a criminal and bad person, when he is simply a man, with a family, trying to live his life without defining himself by mistakes he made when he was younger. They made Christian seem whiny and petulant, when in fact he is just a successful business owner downtown who is understandably concerned about his investment being hurt by a crowd that may possibly cause trouble. Neither of these men deserved to have this story printed about them- everyone had a past they aren't proud of, and that does not make them who they are. There is no reason to go back and forth pointing out every wrong thing so-and-so has done. I have worked for both Brent and Christian, i know both of them personally. They are good people, hardworking, and above all, an asset to this city. I've seen Christian get involved with many charities like St.Baldricks- a non profit that helps fund pediatric cancer research. The minute Brent hears about a local tragedy, be it the death of a child or an illness in a family, he is the first one to put together a fundraiser to help out. If you ask me, Youngstown needs more people like them, who use their popularity and money in a way that makes our community better. Yet, the vindicator feels the need to paint both of them in an unflattering light, just to sell papers.
And its not just Christian and Brents reputations and income at stake here- this story has the potential to shy customers away from the downtown area in general. Why would anyone want to leave the safety of the suburbs to come hang out downtown, if this is the sort of drama they can expect? this story doesn't just affect the people named- if either of the bars start losing business because of this ridiculous article, you know who loses? The people that are employed by both bars- the servers, bartenders, cooks. The college students, the mothers and fathers working a second job, the people saving up to buy homes in this city, the people of Youngstown that are actually trying to make a living and pay taxes. Not to mention, the many many people who have volunteered to try to revamp downtown to make it more appealing (grow in the yo, phil kidd and his relentless efforts to clean up the streets). To all of them, this article is a huge step backwards for everything they've been working for.
The authors should perhaps think of these things before they decide to write an article drumming up needless drama and bad feelings in a time where Youngstown needs to stick together. Shame on you, vindicator- you've lost my respect.

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92kristi32(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

What great charity or fundrasing has odonads done?? Please fill me in blkpride? None the owners suck the food sucks not a person there has any maners the staff suck the food sucks the wait time sucks shall I go on?
A local woman almost died at the hands of her husband 2 years ago yep Brent put on functions for her and her kids to have a christmas!! Christian turned us down when approached!! Great guy! Im done with this petty crap!!
Business is business and The Lemon Grove is a hit! Next big event there proceeds are going to a battered womens shelter is Christian willing to open his doors for an event like this to take place NO!!!

THE REINHARTS ARE SHADY PEOPLE COURT CASES AFTER COURT CASES RECORDS UPON RECORDS AND JAIL TIME FOR TEDDY!!! Just who id want to hang out around...SIKE! I PREFER TO SEND MY BUSINESS TO RESPECTED BUSINESSES NOT MONEY SUCKERS WITH NO GOOD INTENTIONS BUT TO MAKE THEIR POCKETS BIGGER! THIS NEW LAUNCH AT THE LEMON IS A FRESH START FOR ALL INVOLVED AND I GUARANTEE CHRISTIAN WILL BE CLOSED BEFORE THE LEMON GROVE:)

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93spookybartender(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Actually, Kristi, Christian had several fundraisers at his Austintown location in the past year to support Someplace Safe, a battered womens shelter Warren. Also, last Christmas, Odonolds downtown participated in the Santa shuffle, and proceeds went to the Beatitude House in Youngstown.
You can choose to spend your money how you like, but you should probably check your facts before you state fiction as if it were fact.
You're totally buying into the whole "Christian vs. Brent" mentality that the vindicator is trying to promote. how about we change that to "Youngstown vs. a failing economy" and try to support ALL downtown businesses, regardless of any petty bs we may have with who runs it?

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94author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

FEDERAL TAX LIEN FILED 11/12/2012 at 237 p.m. volume 005996 page 1673 Instrument number 20120032446 against George Lenahan. Co-owner of the Lemon Grove LLC with Jacob Harver.

PEOPLE :Please stop bashing the owner of O'Donalds and the current manager of the Lemon Grove and ask the questions of the elected and appointed officials who gave Lenahan and Harver hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars that the people of Youngtown will never get a penny back or a return on their investment.

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95author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Filed 06.13.2013 Recorders Office.

State of Ohio risk #1592755-0 Account No. 11479483

Bureau of Worker's Compensation benefits filed against:

the Lemon Grove LLC (George Lenahan/Jacob Harver)
110 w Federal Street
Youngstown, Oh 44503

Hope no employees get hurt on the job!

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96photoguy330(25 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@Author50 ... you seem to have all the info. What's the total amount of tax dollars that went into this establishment?

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97author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@photoguy330... at least
$1,000.000.00 in total taxpayer funding. Very little actual private equity. The fleecing took place under the name the Rosetta Stone via George Lenahan and then the Lemon Grove LLC (George Lenahan and Jacob Harver).

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98author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

@twentyonetwelve... Idiot(S). members of Youngstown City Council, the Board of Control, The law department, the mayor, Youngstown Muni Loan Fund, MEDVEC and Huntington Bank through the Small business administration loan funds and the president of the United States stimulus programs ALL approved the money for the Rosetta Stone and its child the Lemon Grove LLC:

50 2010 JD 05459 Huntington National Bank JD Certificate of Judgment against George Lenahan

$146,044.12. Status: Open

Lenahan was/is the brains behind Rosetta Stone and the Lemon Grove LLC with Jacob Harver

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99northsideart(111 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

This makes one appreciate the professionalism of the Simons. Through the absolute worst of times they kept a downtown business running. Cedar's probably never received a dime of govt. money either.

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100tk0322(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Way to go!! Let's put Brent Furrie as owner. Hmmm, because all of his previous clubs did oh so well before, huh?? The only people actually "excited" about this new place, are underaged teens, and people who don't know what Furrie has done to previous clubs. Everywhere that man goes, trouble follows. I give it 5 months before all hell breaks lose at "The Library". Hahahahahahaha.

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101author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

50 2010 JD 05460 Huntington National Bank certificate of Judgment against George Lenahan of the Rosetta Stone and now of the Lemon Grove LLC.

Amount $126,248.46

Status: Open

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102Ytownbiz(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

It must be a trend in downtown Youngstown...take a look at the owners of the Federal Bldg., who also happen to be partners in V2 Wine Bar & Trattoria, the Gatta family and one of their companies DSV Builders. They have stiffed Cortland Bank and many local contractors for well over $1,000,000 and yet they hide behind other entities they own and pay no one. However, they still plan on opening up the Gallagher Building for business tenants, including another restaurant they plan to own in that building. Never giving a minute of thought to all those that they have hurt, including a loan officer at the bank who lost his job over their lies and greed!!

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103viatheright(8 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I would never frequent a place like the Lemon Grove. A bunch of clueless snot nosed idiots that own and work there. Why would I spend my hard earned money that I made by sweat blood and tears at a place that is owned by such a left wing idiot who has no clue how to run a business or attract the producers of society.

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104hyatt558(1 comment)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Harver is a stand up man who helped breath life into the downtown area when NOBODY wanted to frequent there.. His demeanor and people skills built Lemon Grove to the success it became. I believe his business entertained potential investors to wake up and see Downtown Youngstown IS a place to consider doing business and being successful in the process. I will support anything this guy does to help the Valley succeed in a comfortable environment to patronize.

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105author50(1121 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

50 2010 JD 05461
Huntington Bank vs George Lenahan.

yet another open judgment for $32,892.26

After leaving the taxpayers the hole in the bagel, George was able to partner up with Jacob Harver and steal more money for them under the new name 110 West LLC dba the Lemon Grove.

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106kurtw(937 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

The Lemon Grove had a good name- a "lemon"- perfect description.

I did go there a couple of times- but wasn't impressed. What really turned me away- and I know this sounds terribly prejudiced- is when I read the place was a favorite of Bobbie Hagan's, so figuring anyplace congenial to him wouldn't be a good place for me- I stayed away.

Then I read the Great Engineer got himself knocked down for mouthing off to a dancer; naturally, being delighted, I decided to go back and check out the scene of the crime (if that's what it was) and I asked a bartender if there was a bronze plaque of some kind to commemorate the spot where Bobbie hit the floor. She said "No" there wasn't anything like that- looking at me, I thought, a bit strangely, so- disappointed- I left for good.

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107auntiem4cabs(113 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

you can change that name a hundred times. bad bad bad shyster owners, con men behind the scene, no 'smarts'.... won't work. It'll be a new name next month.

Hey, here's an idea... why not help a minority white 55 year old with her business and then, I could have a shop downtown, or just a working kitchen where I could bake and ship my product!!! I pay my bills, don't associate with idiots and am just out to make a future for myself. ....hmmmmm never happen.

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108kurtw(937 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Yeah, I remember the lady with the hot dog cart and those were good dogs. She knew the secret of being a good entrepreneur- give people a good reason to part with their money- something of value.

Not exactly rocket science, is it? But expecting Leftos- like the crowd that ran the Lemon Grove- to understand that is like trying to teach a dog to walk on it's hind legs- possible, but not worth the effort.

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109brooke_grace2(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Why has nobody mentioned Harver's, Rinehart's and Furrie's good buddy,
these men all seems to have the the same link , and business dealings with ,
a Mr. Scott Austalosh whose name should also be on that list of , fakes, liars ,thieves frauds, and phoneys with his Ballyhoo music festival front
it was created with Jacob at Lemon Grove in 2011 as a fundraising effort for local cancer charities it was to benefit a group called Christina's Garden , upon closer investigating, the group was based out of New York , and last I looked NY isnt local (it was a flop) , in 2012 Scott brought in Michael Stanley & Joe Vitale Sr. to Lemon Grove , who paid for those appearances ?
Those artists cant be cheap to get .
Its sad when these older rock stars can say
"Before I sold out stadiums and look here I am today in Youngstown at Lemon Grove, in a dark smelly bar, Im rockin with the bums now playing & panhandling for door fees" 3 different charities was picked that year to receive those funds .
Both those artist appearances were also flops and of course "it was the employees fault " that all the pop drinkers came out to see Michael Stanley
Scott's newest vision includes finding & getting investors to buy into his "cancer scam"
At this years Bally fest there was never a mention of cancer or any charity involvement , ..See the link , not a word
http://www.ballyhoomusicfestival.com/...
Harver's good buddy , Scott has been listed as an event director, founder , and band promoter with "all 3 "of these men "in all" the different bars they've operated over the last 3 years
and he manages to do all this while living at 3634 Monica in a Youngstown "low income" Section 8 apartment AND WE the tax-payers also pay for him to stay at home to raise a multi handicapped adopted child ..Google search Scott Austalosh hes been working his scam at many of their bars for years
While your googling look at all 4 of these men's "good buddies" they promote because birds of a feather all flock together .
now Poor Bob Hagan is such a pro Youngstown supporter I think he just gets suckered in and punk'ed like the rest of us
and how come no former employees made mention of Jacob's mental health days when the pressure comes on him & you cant find / or hear from him for days
Ive personally always been worried about whats in that backpack Jacob carries everywhere ?

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110liite(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

You people are so lost. some of you hit it on the head -- staff -- lack of advertising and propert promotion of the business -- horrible timing -- and who the fk wants to bring back a place in shtty ass youngstown. have you seen youngstown and whats come of it? the town is a joke.. people here are a joke.. truly... i laugh at the way you people slander the kid though its a joke -- jacob harver carries himself better then any of you broke ass folks -- you people are hilarious though.. how about this last comment
brooke_grace2(1 day ago
Ive personally always been worried about whats in that backpack Jacob carries everywhere ?
what do you think is in there douchebag?

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111liite(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

its funny though to read some of this sht -- close these fcking clown hangouts -- these people are just hipsters with no use to themselves

and you know what else is a joke? you go from what being a man of standing for something to hiring brent furrie? OL what are you going to do have a 19year old and over drunk fckcapade bar now? this sht is a joke.. STop wasting tax payers dollars on another failed joke of a town in youngstown ohio -- broke ass mother fckers who cant make money without being a douche bag hahahah

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112liite(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

turn it into a AA and DRUG AND LIQUOR REHAB SPOT -- and a gym for all you fat fcks at lunch fighting for food in a half hour like youre dieing for a meal

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113liite(4 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

Its a shame all the money that is sunk into thing's around us for people to go be drunk useless fat douchebags who eat shty processed food and get drunk all day lol

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114brooke_grace2(3 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I think the gun that they will find in Jacob's own mouth is whats in that backpack

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115Libra1983(2 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

its real sad to see people bashing Brent...the ones who are obviously dont know him...he's one of the most kind hearted genuine people out there. As for the under aged drinking that happened...not Brents fault...it's called fake IDs and "I got my older sister/cousin/friends ID for tonite". And its evident that this Rinehart guy is very threatened b/c Brent will draw his people then some to The Knox. What Brent did over a decade ago is irrelevant when u consider how much the MAN has changed! I saw KUDOS to him and am rooting for him that he succeeds where others just could not!!!

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116kurtw(937 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

For Liite:

What kind of drug were you on when you made your posts?

Or, are you just dumb and you write that way cold sober.

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117bmanresident(597 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

I think liite is a product of the Youngstown public education system.

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118Roger_Thornhill(624 comments)posted 1 year, 3 months ago

This is a brutal thread. I am not friends with him, but I do know "of" Scott Austalosh and the person who I know who knows him said he had or has cancer, so maybe that is why he is involved in cancer benefit.

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119candystriper(575 comments)posted 1 year, 2 months ago

what next...a pantless Hagan trick-rolled by angry taxpayer in the former Lemon Grove...

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