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Lack of respect is blot on city



Published: Sun, October 28, 2012 @ 12:00 a.m.

Lack of respect is blot on city

The city of Youngstown has its good and bad areas, as we all know. I grew up in a beautiful area surrounded by well-maintained yards, neighbors who have lived on their block for years and the ice cream truck was always heard. My grandparents still live in this area, however times have drastically changed. Instead of a once lovely neighborhood, vandals have moved in, houses are being burned down and the only sound heard is that of blaring sirens.

I went to visit my elderly grandparents recently and was stopped just before their driveway. Their newspaper box had been vandalized, mangled and was blocking the entrance. I don’t understand what thrill was gained by destroying something that belonged to such compassionate and loving elderly people.

I am appalled and disgusted by the disrespectful punks who decided to vandalize and disrupt the peace once more. What if I was going over there for an emergency? What if the medical emergency supply truck needed to get in the driveway and was blocked? Whatever the scenario, this incident is ridiculous and uncalled for. Show respect toward the elderly and your community before the entire city becomes a slum.

Alexis Perry, Struthers

Job boom from shale gas is real

A recent article in USA Today touted the great high-paying jobs in the energy field thanks to the exploration and drilling taking place near oil and natural gas rich shale deposits.

Due to the rapid expansion of energy development along the eastern side of the state in the Utica shale, additional jobs are being created in Mahoning County to serve the needs of oil and gas workers including the hospitality industry.

More people with higher-paying jobs and industry professionals traveling to our community have led to an increase in spending on food, lodging and entertainment. Mahoning County is collecting additional taxes to support local infrastructure.

It’s time for everyone to realize that the oil and natural gas shale boom brings benefits to all Ohioans through increased tax revenue at the state and local levels, the creation of tens of thousands of new jobs and energy independence.

Randy Budd, Canton

The writer is a vice president of Radius Hospitality, which represents Holiday Inn Boardman, Holiday Inn Canton and Atwood Lake Resort in Carroll County.

Was there equal outrage before?

In last Sunday’s letter, “Beng- hazi response was a disgrace,” the writer claimed that President Obama deliberately lied to the American public about the terrorist attacks on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi. “There was never any indication that the attack was associated with a demonstration, or in response to a video clip on YouTube.”

Contrary to that assertion, four days after the attacks, a CIA document stated, “The currently available information suggests that the demonstrations in Benghazi were spontaneously inspired by the protests at the U.S. Embassy in Cairo and evolved into a direct assault against the U.S. Consulate and subsequently its annex.”

The CIA document adds, “This assessment may change as additional information is collected and analyzed and as currently available information continues to be evaluated.” It took time before U.S. intelligence uncovered new evidence to refute their initial assessment. Once the Obama administration received information that the attacks were not related to the demonstrations in Cairo or the YouTube clip, they refrained from saying that. President Obama did not lie.

After blaming President Obama for the four American deaths at the consulate in Benghazi, the letter stated: “People with a sense of honor resign their office in such circumstances.”

In President Bush’s State of the Union Address in 2003, he lied to the American public about how Saddam Hussein was attempting to seek uranium from Africa to build a nuclear bomb. Bush’s war in Iraq took the lives of 4,488 U.S. service members, and hundreds of thousands of innocent Iraqis.

Did last Sunday’s writer believe President Bush should have resigned?

In 1983, President Reagan had Marines stationed in Beirut, Lebanon, during a civil war. This was against the advice of Secretary of Defense Caspar Weinberger. “They had no mission but to sit at the airport, which is just like sitting in a bull’s-eye,” Weinberger said. “I begged the president at least to pull them back and put them back on their transports as a more defensible position.”

Despite such warnings, President Reagan kept the Marines in a vulnerable position. When the truck bombers drove into the barracks, there was no defense. The terrorist attack killed 220 Marines, 18 sailors and three soldiers.

Does the writer believe President Reagan should have resigned?

Michael Dukes, Youngstown


Comments

1300(553 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

Mr. Dukes has written one of the best letters I've read in a long time. Concise and accurate.

I'm not sure how to explain what has become of the GOP. It seems to have sold its soul to the extreme fringes, and in the process removed practically all the moderates. Thousands of American deaths happened under GOP control, and yet they try to create a scandal when 2 border guards are killed, and 4 in Libya.

My question is why the Democrats didn't act like this after 9-11? Or when we finally realized that Bush had lied about both WMD and the attacks on the Kurds (which happened under his father's watch and were not recent events)?

Now, all we see are post after post about how Obama should resign. This is ridiculous, but we need to question the systematic nature of this response. It seems to me to be Fox News driven, there's no other explanation for the same phrases being used over and over.

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2300(553 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

Reagan didn't inherit 2 wars. If you take Iraq and Afghanistan out of the picture (which were both Bush wars, even though I do believe we were right about Afghanistan at first), then Reagan had more troops die under his watch than Obama.

Out of curiosity, why didn't you account for these 2 conflicts that Obama inherited?

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3ColeK(5 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

I can understand why Mr. Dukes would like to muddy the issue of whether President Obama and his administration spent over a week deceiving the American people by pointing to other episodes of alleged presidential deceit. I have children who, when caught red-handed doing something naughty, defend themselves with a robust "All the other kids do it!" That dog won't hunt.

The essence of a lie is that the statement is false, and the speaker knows it is false. By now, there is acknowledgment that the battle in Benghazi was a terrorist attack, not preceded by a popular demonstration, and unrelated to a video clip posted on YouTube. The only question left is when did the administration know that.

Mr. Dukes points to CIA talking points given to UN Ambassador Rice as reason for her repeated claims on September 14 that "the demonstrations in Benghazi were spontaneously inspired by the protests at the U.S. Embassy Cairo." But this does not jibe with what the president knew within hours of the attack. In an interview given to CBS News the very day after the attack (but not aired for several weeks), Mr. Obama said, "You're right that this is not a situation that was exactly the same as what happened in Egypt, and my suspicion is, is that there are folks involved in this who were looking to target Americans from the start."

So, the President knew by the next day that the Benghazi attack was not the result of a demonstration gone wild. It had nothing to do with an offensive video. Yet a full week after the attack, he was still misleading the American people about that. David Letterman asked him if the attack was an act of war. He replied, “No. Here’s what happened. You had a video that was released by somebody who lives here, sort of a shadowy character, that is an extremely offensive video directed at Mohammed and Islam, making fun of the prophet Mohammed. And so this caused great offense in much of the Muslim world. But what also happened was extremists and terrorists used this as an excuse to attack a variety of our embassies, including the one, the consulate in Libya.” That was false, and he knew it.

Now the question of whether the Administration was negligent in not providing the enhanced security requested by the consulate before the attack, and whether it was derelict in not having the military attempt to aid the embattled Americans in Benghazi, are certainly troubling questions, and potentially a stronger indictment of the Administration than the lies about the attack. But they are separate questions. Similarly, questions concerning how many soldiers died during various presidents’ administrations not only fail to consider whether the campaigns in which they served were worthwhile efforts, but are also askew our question here.

Our question here is: Did Obama lie about the attack in Benghazi? The answer to that question, evident to all except those blinded by partisanship, is a resounding yes.

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4WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300
@YBR

Hey! I didn't know you guys had the credentials and security clearances high enough to be informed about WMD in Iraq.

On second thought, I don't think you do have the education let alone credentials to accurately speak to anything at all about WMD in Iraq.

Tell you what, if either of you can tell us which agencies are responsible for providing security credentials for those of us that are informed and specifically name and locate the facilities in the U.S. where contractors that were in Iraq and saw first hand what was there work, we'll believe you.

Those of us that have the education and clearance to speak with any authority at all on WMD in Iraq know the answers to these questions.

If you guys cannot answer these questions, then you're just another pair of loud-mouthed liberal talking heads with uninformed opinions- parrots that simple repeat whatever nonsense is delivered to their ears.

Show us what you have big mouths! We'll hold our breath.

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5300(553 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

If WMD had been found they would've been plastered all over the news.

I won't even lower my standards to speak about my past in the same post as one that includes "contractors". If college dropouts who can't find work in the US are what you're basing your perspective on, then you're not someone with any valuable information.

There were no WMD. Now, you can try to change the definition of what WMD is, and try to include chemical weapons. But, we all know that when Bush made his case he did so with nuclear threats, not mustard gas.

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6300(553 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

I will say this, William. This is a public forum, anyone with any integrity would refrain from any dialogue like the one you posted.

I get the impression that you were/are a contractor. Given that you've posted before, I believe, that you're retired, this does call into question the validity of this. But, I wouldn't be surprised, since contractors are held to such low standards, I could see one coming on here and posting about it. That's why they're a contractor, and not an agent.

I'll admit, I wouldn't even sit at the same table as a contractor. As you can tell, I've got no respect for this type of person. That being said, no one on a security clearance would be drunkenly posting on Vindy forums.

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7chuck_carney(499 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

The central question in my mind is why didn't the president take decisve action to protect the lives of the four who died representing our country.

Second why hasn't the president given a press conference to provide answers to the tough questions for the American people?

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8WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

So you cannot prove you are qualified or informed then. Not surprised. Why don't you shut up about it then. Stop running your mouth about issues you know nothing about.

What is wrong with you by the way? I have no idea what associations go through your mind when the word "contractor" is mentioned but they are patently incorrect. The very notion that you think civilian contractors are somehow beneath the level they actually are proves that you are completely ignorant to the reality of military and government work.

Civilian contractors in military and government service are very highly educated, highly skilled, often former military or government employees and professionals, often Ph.D. educated in the sciences or higher, that are no longer under formal enlistment of military or government service yet are sought after and retained for their skills. Civilian contractors in the government and military usually have very high security clearance which they obtained during their public employ. They are often highly paid, very successful and respected members of their professional communities.

Do you understand now?

The answers are:

The U.S. Department of Energy
The Federal Bureau of Investigation
Y12 Processing Facility in Tennessee

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9WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

Look at some of the ridiculous, stupid things you say:

"That's why they're a contractor, and not an agent."

An agent? Agent of what? The CIA? You actually *think* that the people that dealt with WMD in Iraq were CIA agents? Man are you living in a fantasy world. Highly trained scientists and technical workers were the individuals informed of and handling WMD in Iraq. That is a requirement. They stuff they handle and do is dangerous. You have to have the training to safely discover, collect and transport materials used in weapons. Do you even know what materials are being spoken of? Biological components, explosives, nuclear materials. You think there are "college dropouts" investigating biological, chemical and nuclear materials? You are a FOOL. How long do you think a "college dropout" would survive after being exposed to nuclear materials? You know nuclear materials are radioactive, right? You know that just being near them will kill you, right? I have said it before and will say it again: you have no education to speak of in engineering, mathematics, physics, biology, chemistry, etc. You just act like you do and run your mouth. It's sad that there are people out there with such high levels of insecurity that they have to pretend to be something they aren't.

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10WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

"I wouldn't even sit at the same table as a contractor."

You wouldn't be PERMITTED to sit at the same table as civilian contractors associated with WMD in Iraq. You wouldn't be permitted through the gates. You lack the education, skills, credentials and security clearance required. There would be no point in allowing a member of the general public, such as yourself, into such sensitive arenas where their ignorance would only get them injured or killed. The issues may all seem like a game to you, perhaps something from a spy or military movie you've seen, but they are not. The civilian contractors handle dangerous, sensitive materials that require training and skills in calculus, biology, chemistry and nuclear physics just to be near them and walk away again without serious injuries or being killed outright.

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11WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

"If WMD had been found they would've been plastered all over the news."

Yeah? If you say so. Some agencies and people are less concerned with making press releases and defending themselves to the public than they are with doing a job and keeping people safe. Some people don't "spike the football" for personal attention while risking sensitive information and lives to get credit or win over opinions. The bottom line remains. You don't know anything at all about what was in Iraq but you run your mouth against the people that did and made it all safe for you over those years.

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12WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

"...anyone with any integrity would refrain from any dialogue like the one you posted."

Anyone with integrity would not go on running their mouths off about things they know NOTHING about. You speak of integrity but you are a FRAUD, sir. You have no knowledge whatsoever about WMD or what happened in Iraq beyond what Keith Olberman told you. Yet you sit here and represent to the world that you are informed and qualified and can pass judgement. You don't know anything at all. So shut up.

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13WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

"...when Bush made his case he did so with nuclear threats."

You crackhead liberals are the only ones that try to redefine WMD all the time. But you at least got one thing right. The primary threat was nuclear. You could try to prove to us all once more that your opinion is informed if you can name the nuclear material and how it was disposed. Good luck, parrot.

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14WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

"...no one on a security clearance would be drunkenly posting on Vindy forums."

Really? You think that the mere mention of the words "sensitive information" is somehow a betrayal of a "security clearance?" This is just dumb. And you are still trying to cover up for the fact that your big liberal mouth once more got you into a jam and you got called out for it. Just admit that you do no know anything about WMD in Iraq. You already HAVE admitted it with your pathetic lack of understanding.

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15WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

@300

"...I get the impression that you were/are a contractor. ...you're retired... ...since contractors are held to such low standards..."

Oh, I get it. You are trying to offend and insult me. Ad hominem again. Shocking. It doesn't work, especially if the accusations don't apply.

You are wrong. I'm not retired- not even close. I was never a civilian contractor or even close to being one. I was around people, circumstances and facilities because I used similar tools for work- sometimes nearby or in the same places.

Maybe you could consider the possibility that there are people in the world that tell the truth about who they are and what they know. They don't have to come on some blog and lie to make themselves seem important or relevant. Some people have actual integrity, confidence and security in themselves, their understanding, their education. They don't need to pretend in order to feel significant. You should try it.

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16WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

Weren't able to address the question of your qualifications and knowledge, eh? Whatever, YBR.

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17AnotherAverageCitizen(1174 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

It would be hard to be an expert on WMD in Iraq when there were no WMD. Its hard to be an expert on something that did not exist.

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18dawn421(265 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

Oh my! There goes William again with his inflated ego calling people uneducated. My goodness, he must be the only person in the area that attended school if the rest of us are so uneducated. You are a small minded man that can only focus on bashing Democrats. So please respond with your big words that make you feel superior to us " uneducated liberals" as you like to say. As a supposed civilian contractor do you profit from the war? And as an American, did you lose a family member or friend in Mr Bush's war over imaginary WMD? I did!!!! So please shut the pie hole already.

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19dawn421(265 comments)posted 1 year, 9 months ago

William has to take a few days off to prepare for his. BS. Takes a minute to get it right

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20WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 8 months ago

Look at all the liberal loons on the water! Dumb421, YoungstownBornAndRetarded, AnotherAbominableCrackhead. My, they're beautiful to see this late in the season. They all seem a little agitated. Maybe it's that Dear Leader is losing. Maybe their tin foil hats need tightened.

Tell us, WMD experts, what exactly are you calling WMD these days? Let me guess, WMD is whatever wasn't found in Iraq. Anything that was found there isn't WMD. Right?

If you want to have a real debate then take a concrete position on what EXACTLY is WMD and what is not.

The challenge remains. Who among you can name the things that WERE found in Iraq? Were these things WMD? Let's see if the crackheads above can address the questions.

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21dawn421(265 comments)posted 1 year, 8 months ago

you are an ignorant little man william, you constantly resort to name calling on this site and it is getting to be tiresome. i am sure i am not the only person that will take offense to being called a crackhead!!!!!! And was it not a fact that both parties admitted there were no WMD in Iraq?

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22WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 8 months ago

The challenge still remains, dumb421.

Who among you can name the things that WERE found in Iraq? Were these things WMD? Is yellowcake uranium considered WMD? How about heavy ordinance?

Do anything but address the questions dummy421. Just admit the reason you do not address the points and cannot answer the questions is because you have no knowledge, credentials, education or experience at all.

WMD is another one of those amorphous titles that can be and was morphed into anything the liberal crowd wanted. And the liberal crowd wanted GWB to fail. Isn't this what the liberals are accusing others of doing to BHO? Funny.

My how they forget, eh? These same panty-waisted cowards were first in line to send troops when 9/11 was still fresh and haunting them. Wasn't until after the Marines were on the ground that they all remembered they were pacifist traitor scumbag liberals and had to turn back. Simple cowardice but I digress.

You and the other scumbag liberal cowards have no idea whatsoever the kinds of things that were in Iraq and what happened to them. All you know is what your liberal puppet-masters told you. If the MSM told you there were zombie clowns posing for pictures and making it rain Skittles in Iraq you bunches of nutjobs would be running to get your candy dishes and cameras.

Cowards, liars, morons all of you. Prove me wrong if you can. But you can't.

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23WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 8 months ago

@YBR

You know, you still haven't come clean and admitted that you don't have any education relevant to these matters, are not informed by any credible source and lack the credentials to be adequately informed. Or is your lack of addressing the point just such an admission?

I don't feel retarded. Anyway, I went and gave these links a fair, critical evaluation.

On The Right Perspective, the supposed links to the quotes do not work. There isn't a single quotation from Rove's book in this "article," only paraphrase. That means we don't know what Karl said, only what the author interprets him as saying. Provide the quote and I'll take a look. Quotes from major journalism outlets are worth more than donkey-squat too. I never heard of this outlet and do not trust it as far as I could throw it. Find a better source- one that can be verified.

On the YouTube video GWB says that Hussein did not have WMD but had the capacity to produce WMD. He says this very clearly. I assume he is referring to the chemical weapons that remained active as well as the nuclear materials stockpiled in Iraq. I really do not know what GWB meant exactly. Neither do you. But it is known that Iraq had a nuclear program, was stockpiling nuclear materials and had enough low-grade enriched uranium to produce a nuclear warhead on the order of a forty megaton device. That is equivalent to our Fat Man device dropped on Hiroshima. Of course the device was not built and it is now known that Iraq was several years away from being able to build a device. But the simple fact that the materials were stockpiles clearly indicates the capacity to produce WMD just like GWB said.

Maybe you could inform yourself better with these...

"Uranium shipped to Montreal from Iraq in top secret mission"

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/20...

Here is an article from the CBC which details very well the shipments of half a million tons of yellowcake uranium from Iraq to a buyer in Canada around 2008. How do we explain the rhetoric of "no WMD's" when half a million tons of yellowcake uranium is known to have shipped out of Iraq? Maybe it is the definition of WMD? Maybe it is something else. But the fact remains that half a million tons of yellowcake uranium was shipped to a buyer in Canada. There is more than that.

Just as many tons of uranium were shipped to Canada there were many tons of yellowcake uranium that was shipped from Irag to the U.S. These shipments were handled in part at the Y12 Processing Facility in Oak Ridge Tennessee and the final disposition is not known. This facility can enrich and de-enrich nuclear materials and combine them in the right ratios/mixtures for use in fuel rods, reactors, weapons, etc. Who knows where the material ended up. I suspect it was combined into other materials and enriched to produce fuel for our nuclear warships and submarines.

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24WilliamSwinger(341 comments)posted 1 year, 8 months ago

"U.S. Removes Two Tons of Uranium From Iraq"

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,1...

Here is another article which details how "...1.95 tons of low-enriched uranium [shipped from Iraq] could be used to produce enough highly enriched uranium to make a single nuclear bomb." This was shipped from Iraq in 2004. Did you ever hear of this find? Not from the liberal goof MSM. This is an AP article by the way. Only Fox ran it for any length of time.

These are credible articles and factual accounts of significant amounts of nuclear materials found in Iraq and shipped out. Do you consider nuclear weapons, even low grade "dirty bombs" to be WMD? I do. So does every governing agency in the world.

So tell me now how a few piss-ant liberal goofball bobble heads in an around Youngstown that lack the credentials, education and understanding to even understand the realities on the ground in Iraq under GWB that doubt whether or not WMD were in Iraq make any difference at all- especially since the record contradicts them.

And all this is just the tip of the iceberg. This is the de-classified public consumption stuff. What do you think the classified stuff looks and sounds like?

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