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State employees sacrifice pay for better pensions
TweetState employees sacrifice pay for better pensions
EDITOR,
One of our Youngstown members forwarded a copy of your June 26 editorial, “Budget debate shows gap between public and private.”
Did the writer ever hear the adage, “You must compare apples to apples?” State employees receive their compensation in a different package than private sector employees. For the most part, state workers receive a smaller pay scale for similar work in the private sector. State workers pay into a pension system that was established prior to the federal government establishing Social Security. State workers put 10 percent of their earnings into the pension fund, and the state 14 percent. Why would the state agree to pay so much? The answer is quite simple: the 14 percent amount is a lot lower than the comparable salary rate for private sector jobs. It is a win, win situation for the taxpayers and the workers. Taxpayers hire competent employees to get the work done for fewer dollars, and workers take less pay to reap better benefits at retirement.
Once the payments are made to the retirement system, the taxpayer liability is done. They have hired competent workers for less pay, even including the 14 percent, and have no future liability for them. The pension system invests the employee and employer deposits, and over the years generates enough income to provide a better pension and benefit package than Social Security and most 401Ks.
The private sector workers receive their compensation package in a different format. They receive higher pay. The worker and company each pay 6.2 percent of their salary into Social Security, and some workers have the option of paying additional monies into a company pension. Some companies will even contribute matching funds, so long as the employee purchases company stock. Private company employees receive their compensation up front, and have the option of additional investments for their future. What they don’t have is any just cause to be jealous of our public employees who have sacrificed higher income through the years for the benefit of a decent, and might I add, a well deserved pension at retirement.
WILLIAM I. WINEGARNER, Administrator
Public Employee Retirees Inc.
Westerville
Follow the business model
EDITOR:
I see our Gov. Strickland is having problems getting the Ohio operating budget to balance. I have a suggestion: Why doesn’t he play “private enterprise” and cut. He could start with a 5 percent to 15 percent compensation cut for all state employees and then require a 20-to-25 percent contribution to their health care.
I would guess if these were invoked, the budget would be balanced and fewer than 5 percent of the employees would leave their jobs.
GORDON WILLIAMS
Canfield
Comments
Mr. Winegarner obviously didn't read the original commentary. Public workers not only have better pensions, they have better wages too. All thanks to the taxpayers. But that will end as the taxpayers will stop funding those outrageous wages and benefits for their employees.
Mr. Apollo.
Thanks for your input but can you show us your data supporting your comments about outrageous wages and benefits?
Why do you think Mr Winegarner didn't read the original commentary? Some people know the truth about state government operations. He does, but obviously you don't! You sound like a very bitter person.
Would you like to continue having public services like snow and ice free streets, clean state parks, secure jails and prisons, help for those on medicare, schools post and elementary, unemployment compensation, etc? Do you want those public employees still working to work for free to provide this stuff and at whatever rate of low pay you think they should have? Do you realize a lot of state agencies have other revenue to pay employees besides GRF monies?
Again too, why do you think state employee pay is largest part of the Ohio State budget? It isn't. Entitlements and health care, prisons, and schools payments and other social services are what eats up the budget. Do you know anything about how state government works. Show us your facts. Put up your facts or shut up.
Winegarner also does not mention health care benefits, paid holidays/vacation time, ect.
Do you think it's because it weakens his argument?
Mr. Galrads, since you mention schools - my wife is a teacher, and her salary, benefits, and retirement are ALL generous (way better than my private sector job, and I have a Bachelor's and Master's degree).
Mr. JME.
Why should it weaken his argument? Majority of state employees don't earn the big bucks unlike their counter parts in the private sector. Part of this imbalance is offset with decent health care benefits. The leave time is not unlike private sector. Should government employees continue to earn less ? Probably, it has been their choice. Not sure what your major is but maybe your wife looked at her career journey closer than yours making the decision she did. Maybe? Used to be a saying something like "get a college diploma and you'll earn a comfy living". Nothing's guaranteed in life. Some folks get the diploma thinking they'vd got it made here on out like cradle to grave stuff but really aren't worth more than the paper their diploma is printed on. I don't think that is you but this portfolio fits a lot of now jealous people enviable of others who may have succeeded more with less. Kinda getting of the subject but I wanted to respond to your edu statement.
Galrads, leavetime for State employees is nowhere near the private sector. No private employer gives holiday pay for days such as Presidents Day or Martin Luther King's Day - where have you been?
Have you checked what the private sector and their employers pay for health care coverage?
Who picks up the tab to cover the State's part to cover what the State employees receive?
Yes, those are some big benefits that Mr. Retirement didn't want to include in his retirement letter.
Forgot to add, the diploma's will get you farther.
Why do you thing the Mahoning Valley workforce is in it's current position?
I myself can move on to another region to get a job. The un-educated who are stuck in this area will not be able to adapt without re-training.
It's a fact of life that to be successful in this day and age, you need to get an education. If not, you will be left behind - and that is the problem with this area, and soon, the Government work force.
Earning the big bucks? What about the big bucks to receive health care coverage? That is part of the income, and Obama wants to start taxing those benefits. And that is a big part that is hurting private industry employers.
Don't you think that the State (and tax payers) is hurting providing the same high-cost health insurance coverage to the State employees? My wife pays very little for health insurance, and the schools are picking up a big chunk of that cash. I benefit, but I think it's wrong that tax payers are picking up the tab.
To compare apples-to-apples, the health insurance benefits and all of the frevolous holiday's must be included.
How many paid holidays do the State employees receive?
Back in 2004 for a medium-sized manufacturer, the average premium was over $1,000 per month for a single person - family coverage was much higher.
This is one of the big reasons why manufacturers and other private sector employers found it difficult to survive.
How can the State of Ohio afford to provide health insurance without the tax payer's help, or increasing the State employees contribution?
Just imagine what the costs are now, and what the taxpayers are picking up.
State employees, find out what your employers health premiums are and you'll realize how much compensation you are receiving.
MR. JME. Why is it the private sector wasn't complaining about government until greed took our economy down.
You are confusing a few issues here. Mr. Retirement is talking about retirements and how once each side contributes their share to OPERS state government is then out of the picture.
You'd do well as a politician maybe as you like to blend things and spin them to make a not so bad pic look worse. Let's talk retirement not employment.
MR. JME.
I'm not disagreeing with you but let's put Apples to Apples. State Employees earn less than their compliments in the private sector. Health insurance is based on a group rate. Given 50,000 government employees in the pool and state contributions to health care coverage premiums are less than in most situations in the private sector.
If we don't want public services we shouldn't have them but I don't think we should say government employees are worth less because private sector jobs.
Health benefits (plus paid holidays) are part of the State employees compensation, and continues to rise at a ridiculous pace - the taxpayers are paying for this compensation. The private sector employees are paying way more out of pocket than a State employee, thus reducing there take home pay.
A State employees compensation package is not based on salary and retirement benefits alone - the letter writer left out a chunk of apple which would not back his argument.
Mr Galrads, there was an article that this commentary was based on in the Vindy. It said that public workers earn around $39 an hour total in wages and benefits and the private sector earns around $28 in wages and benefits. I'd say that is a pretty large difference considering it's the people making $28 an hour paying the wages and benefits of those making $39 an hour. That disparity simply cannot be maintained.
Hi, again, Mr. Appollo.
I don't like games politicians play to protect their own self interests as it pits everyone against each other, private and public. That is what is going on right now as they work (?) on the new state budget. The proposed new budget cuts hurt a lot of people needing the services or they risk the stability of income for others. I.e., I believe there is one proposal to borrow from the state's largest pension system to help balance the budget. Slippery slope here. Look at what happened to other federal retirement subsidy systems like social security as a result of the Feds borrowing from it for other uses. Social Security is not meant to be a retirement system but it was somewhat stable until all the borrowing. Is it going to be there when all the baby boomers face retirement? Are the younger people correct in having bad attitudes about putting money into a system which they probably won't see any benefit? Yes. So why place more people in similar bad situations and needing other public assistance to survive by borrowing from OPERS (with no guarantees it will be paid back... in what, 10 years?... when we don't have to.
There is a lot of waste in government true, but I can not be condescending or blame workers as the major cost of the budget or the cause of the revenue shortfall. If there is blame to place it should be on supervision and management for not being more efficient and frugal.
To see what state government salaries are go to: http://careers.ohio.gov/
Now regarding salaries, would we want to go to a doctor earning 28 or 38 USDs an hour? I don't think so. We get what we pay for and if we don't want the government services we should push for government to downsize w/o losing health, national security and safety nets.
I'm not for the size of government proposed in Wash. D.C. but I sure want police and fire protection, clean air, safe roads etc. etc. around when I need them and that isn't happening like it should now in most places. The safety people put their lives on the line for us and earn every bit of their salaries. Don't you think?
If we want to straighten up government and place blame on expenses we should look at reforming services like medicaid and medicare. They are the biggest expense in government besides national defense and defense should not be touched.
Mr Galrads, the taxpayers can't afford to pay their employees more than the taxpayers themselves make. Public service has gotten out of control. It used to pay less than private sector work but had better benefits to make up for the shortfall. The cost of government has ballooned to unsustainable levels. Much of it employee cost including health care and pensions the envy of the working world. I get taxed around 50% and can't pay any more. Government at all levels is simply bloated with overpaid and under worked people. Comparing a doctor to a state worker is asinine. Paying top dollar for police and firemen doesn't guarantee the best employees. Most have connections to get those jobs. Many public employees are political payback jobs.
Mr. Apollo. There is a lot of truth to what you say about attitudes and overkill on numbers of government employees. Watchout for more of that if our friends in Washington get their way and expand government employment more. However, Its not unfair to compare private and public jobs. There are some darn good professionals in government too, which includes doctors, nurses, psychiatrist, engineers. Do you want to underpay the engineer designing bridges and safety devices for our highways. Should we pay the doctors and nurses in government less than their compliments in the private sector? Not in my book. I prefer to see competent professionals in those positions.
We've kinda gotten off the track again. Regarding the slippery slope which our governor wants to place one of the retirement systems in, that's not going to work for anyone. Once the state pays its agreed share into OPERS, the state is out of the picture and another entity such as OPERS works on making the retirees single life annuities which goverment employees buy into. There are now other retirement options at OPERS but the bulk are single life like annuities.
So, if OPERS becomes insolvent or unsustainable and can't deliver retiree benefits because of the borrowing from it by state government to help others, well, no more retirees is possibly the result. This situation becomes more critical if the state doesn't pay back what they borrow either. Sounds like what happened to social security doesn't it?
Do you want to give up any annuity you may have worked and paid for and own for similar purposes? Heck, why don't we ask everyone in the private and public sectors to do that and give the proceeds to government. That kind of action would take care of all government problems, wouldn't it? I believe it is not right to make one person miserable because someone else is. Or do you disagree with that? Government may need cleaning up but robbing from retirees isn't right.