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Ex-pastor pleads innocent to rapes



Published: Sat, February 28, 2009 @ 12:10 a.m.

By Peter H. Milliken

Dale Giffin will stand trial May 11 on six counts of rape.

YOUNGSTOWN — The former pastor of a Cornersburg church has pleaded innocent to six counts of rape.

Dale Giffin, who had been pastor of Zion Lutheran Church, was arraigned Friday before Judge R. Scott Krichbaum of Mahoning County Common Pleas Court.

Judge Krichbaum set Giffin’s bond at $60,000 with 10 percent acceptable. Giffin, who appeared in court with his lawyer, J. Gerald Ingram, immediately posted the $6,000 bond.

A trial date was tentatively set for May 11 before Judge James C. Evans.

The Mahoning County grand jury indicted Giffin, 59, of Topaz Circle, Canfield, on Feb. 19. The indictment alleges Giffin raped a parishioner while she was a young adult between 1993 and 1996.

The alleged offenses occurred in various places, including Giffin’s office, car and residence, and in the Canfield Road church basement and sacristy, according to Atty. Dawn Cantalamessa, an assistant county prosecutor.

The case was investigated by the county sheriff’s department.

Giffin had served Zion Lutheran for nearly 30 years until his resignation last fall.

Judge Krichbaum told Giffin he is to have no contact with the accuser; he may not leave Ohio without the court’s permission; and he must immediately surrender his passport to the court. He also may not own, use or possess any firearms.

Ingram handed Giffin’s passport to Atty. James MacDonald, an assistant county prosecutor, in court.

Also arraigned Friday before Judge Krichbaum were two suspects who were indicted Thursday on charges of murder and improperly discharging a firearm at or into a habitation in last Saturday’s shooting death of Melkanoe L. Bowman.

Judge Krichbaum set bond at $200,000 each for the suspects: Keilan A. Clinkscale, 20, of Coronado Avenue, and Ryan J. McGee, 22, of Superior Street.

Their trial was tentatively set for June 8 before Judge John M. Durkin.

Bowman, 24, was shot in the head in the 900 block of Delaware Avenue on the city’s North Side in what police said was a feud. A bullet from the shooting also wounded a 6-year-old boy across the street in his left foot as he slept.

In another recent high-profile case, Bryce D. Burke, 26, of Mercedes Place, Canfield, who was indicted Feb. 19 on a charge of failing to stop after an accident, waived his arraignment in open court, pleaded innocent, and waived speedy trial in a Thursday filing by Atty. Ingram, who also represents Burke.

Burke is accused of driving away after being alerted by a motorist to a body being dragged beneath his car while in the McDonald’s drive-though at South Avenue and Midlothian Boulevard on Nov. 29.

Andrew Culp, 22, of North Main Street, Columbiana, who died of his injuries, was found in the westbound lane of Midlothian Boulevard near Euclid Boulevard, two blocks from the fast-food restaurant.

Burke surrendered to detectives Dec. 1.


Comments

1KEOSHA(13 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

DATS A DAMN SHAME

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2truthrus(16 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

What a fine mess this has turned out to be! After reading the comments made by members and non members I decided to make a few comments as well. Dale has meant many things to many people over the past 30 years and it is no surprise that tyhe congregation is divided. But we as members must face the facts and realize that Dale had a flawed personality . His inner circle were always on council and the finance and salary review committees, guarenting a fat salary and total control of Zion. We now have to ask the HARD questions that Dale did not want us to know....
why did we have the same treasurer(s) for years?? why is Dale still in charge of the Daycare and where do the monies from the Daycare go?? when have we had an independant audit of the church and the daycare.. not by anyone sitting on council or a member of this church?? Has anyone ever noticed that the yearly budget does't balance.. do we even know what the line items listed under salaries and taxes and fdic are and to whom they belong?? what are the job discriptions of these highly payed individuals and is it justified? Why is it that the same family members are chairmen of the salary review?? Who gave the tyhe right to give Dale a $74,000.00 severence pay without aslking the congregation for a vote on that kind of money?????
Was this severance pay to be used to pay for his defence? Why is it any question asked of the council is always viewed as we are challenging their authority?? Who do we go to if we have a complaint or a question when all of counil seems to be against anyone who disagrees with them?? Why do we still have investments with Giffin Investments when we have Investment companies here in Youngstown who could handle our portfolio!!! And above all else where were the long term council members when the years of allegations were being made and couldn't these men and women connect the dots and see that there was a pattern and either find Dale help or report to the synid that he was out of control???? Or was it easier for some of you to go with Dale to strip clubs... how irresponsible!!!! Members of Zion are looking at council, at the financial and salary review committes and asking that they sit down and answer the questions that really need to be answered befor we have a shot at re-building the church... there can't be business as usual and transparency in ALL areas of the church are needed and we the members of Zion who are asked each and every year to step up our financial giving to the church are no longer going to sit silently by ! Give us a Christ centered church and no more greedy CEO's!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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3XFilesX(77 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Sounds to me like this church needs a complete overhaul in pastors, council, secretary, treasurers, committees, etc. The congregation has obviously been let down. I have absolutely NO IDEA how things like this go, so who can come in and monitor it and reorganize it? Who do you turn to? Maybe the answer is to disband and reform under the NEW ZION church or give it a new name with a fresh approach. And if the congregation is split, the ones who are on this fallen pastor's side should go and start over and the ones who are no should stay and reorganize. Why should they pay for this fallen pastor's mistakes. I just looked at the website and the church looks very nice. Maybe that is the problem. The pastor got too big for his position. He got proud and greedy and thought he could do what he wanted. I don't know. But I'm sure there is a better pastor who is more humble and more CHRIST centered and who loves the WORD more than the BUCK.

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4letlightshine(8 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Zion Lutheran Church is part of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America[ELCA] and not an independent entity. The leadership needs to face the fact that their former pastor did violate women and humbly turn to the bishop and her staff for assistance and direction. The ELCA has pastors trained to deal with the aftermath of sexual misconduct. There are many "humble Christ centered Lutheran pastors who love the WORD more than the BUCK "who could in time serve Zion well. They had two excellent ones in Mark and Chuck, faithful servants of Christ!
How could a former “man of the cloth” plead innocent in the civil court yet by removing himself from the denomination[at no one’s request] in essence declares guilt? One steps outside the jurisdiction of the denomination when one knows that thru church legal action, he would be found guilty. We hoped you’d show a bit of honesty Dale and plead “no contest”..or better yet save the tax payers and plead guilty! I guess honesty is too high of a price to pay? It would be a gift from God to see justice done on this case in Mahoning County! We can only pray!

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5XFilesX(77 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

I really hope that this church congregation can find their way. I do not belong to this church but I agree with letlightshine who said 'How could a former “man of the cloth” plead innocent in the civil court yet by removing himself from the denomination[at no one’s request] in essence declares guilt?' and it was enlightening to hear 'One steps outside the jurisdiction of the denomination when one knows that thru church legal action, he would be found guilty.' This pastor sounds like a true predator. How sad for your flock. There muct be some way to circumvent the local church and have ELCA step in.

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6sue(173 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

to LETLIGHTSHINE - The ELCA better get its act together. They said it would be at least a year before Zion gets a new pastor. The church will NOT survive that long. This is an emergency situation and they need to get a new permanent pastor ASAP. People will leave the church. My family has been members for decades and we are on the verge of moving on.

The church is biggger than Dale Giffin. It is time to move on with a new vision.

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7shiningstar(4 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Come on people of Zion, this man is NOT a Lutheran pastor, never has been. He is a slick, common criminal of the worst kind, and for 29 years, a predator of children and trusting women. He has been an insult to the clergy and a truly poor example of "What Jesus Would Do." I can't help but wonder in all his arrogance, just what he thinks Jesus Will Do? The way I see it, his only hope is confession.

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8IknowZion(8 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

This so-called pastor has been raping, pillaging and plundering for 30years. Don't let this fool break up such a wonderful congregation. Now is the time to get together, pick it up, and make Zion the best it can be. Wipe the slate clean and start anew. He is no longer there to dictate. Remember, the PEOPLE are the church, not the pastor, although Dale thought the other way around. I pray to God that the church will survive. You CAN make it work!

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9shiningstar(4 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

I will pray for the people of Zion, and hope that they will see that they need to rid themselves of ALL thoes who would support Dale and his criminal behavior. PLEASE folks read the comments of truthrus that person has raised some extremely GOOD questions that really do require answers. Think about it, why did Dale choose to step down instead of answer to the ELCA. To me that was an admision of quilt. I will also pray for Dale that he will see the error of his ways and ask for forgiveness from our Father and from all thoes he has assaulted.

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10Thinkinoutloud(1 comment)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Do others wonder if the severence pay was equal to or close to the figure Jerry Ingram will charge to defend this predator? For years the four annointed have rotated the position of president of the congregation to protect the pastor and his empire. The only way Zion can go forward successfully is for the entire council to resign and allow new leadership to flourish. The light is finally beginning to shine and reveal the true reasons why Pastor Mark chose to leave and Pastor Chuck was asked to leave. Shame on you members of council.

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11truthrus(16 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Zion members unite! Our congregation needs to attend the next council meeting held on March 17 at 7 PM and ask the HARD questions those in the know have avoided ansering all these years! I don't doubt that many of the church council are decent people who were unwittingly sucked into Dale's deception but given the mess we are in and the budget and severence pay given at the January meeting it is safe to say that even without Dale this council has decided to carry on business as usual. And for some we sit afraid to say anything and come away just as intimadated as when Dale stood before us. It is hard to change anything alone.. but our voices can be heard if we unite and finally speak our concerns.. together! I'm certain some of you have asked the same questions over the years silently to yourselves.. so let's ask together, let's ask questions in a non accousatory mannor but once and for all let us not be silent or give up and leave Zion without the answers as hundreds of former members have done! If the attitude toward us is a negative and non compliant one then we'll know that we will have no future with such a church. Let's call the church today and let them know we are attending the March council meeting (it is your right as a member) and want answers to our questions! Unite through CHRIST and God bless us al!

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12scrappy(20 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

LOOKS LIKE OLD DUDE HERE JUST MIGHT BE FIXIN TO TRADE IN HIS HIGH FALUTANT LIFESTYLE AND CANFIELD MANSION FOR AN 8 BY 10 CONCRETE BOX AT THE LOCAL STATE PEN. THE ONLY STRIP CLUB THEY HAVE THERE IS THE ONE WHERE YOU STRIP, GET BUTT-NAKED AND GET CHECKED FOR CONTRABAND BY THE GUARDS. GOOD RIDDINGS TO ANOTHER LOW-LIFE THAT NEVER LEARNED HIS LESSON TILL NOW.

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13aeparish(669 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Riddings. Hahaha.

It's RIDDANCE.

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14Stan(9923 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

The culture of the valley thrives from the pulpit on down. It is way past time for a change.

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15finefamily(4 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

As a former member of Zion,Dale has always been arrogant and uncaring to the members of the congregation. Every sermon he gave included remarks that we were not giving enough money. I do feel sad for the victims he has affected.He had such an opportunity to do well with such a large congregation. The council members should be ashamed of themselves they were entrusted with a position to insure chuch was order. However apparantly the feeling of power is much more important than actually doing good work. The congregation needs to rid themselves of the council and all who aided Dale. They have already lost good members when they got rid of Pastor Mark and Pastor Chuck yet no council members even cared Shame on them Those two Pastors did more good then you can even begin to count. Instead they sided with Dale very poor choice. Congregation of Zion use your heads and use this time to make things right. there are many good people who deserve better than you have given them.

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16scrappy(20 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

There is an easy way for a church congregation to gain control of the council. Withhold your contributions until every last one of them gets out of there. Money talks and the council's crooked business will walk. Corruption will not hang around empty coffers. When they are gone, you can start rebuilding that church with JESUS in charge instead of Dale Giffin leading it down the road to perdition. Was that a church or was it just a big old crime scene that should have been roped off decades ago?

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17Eric(196 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

People, come on now. Do I need to point out that this man has been convicted of NOTHING. All of you are functioning as the judge, jury, and executioner. Have any of you ever heard of a jury? Or that sometimes police and prosecutors are wrong? Or that sometimes supposed victims aren't actually victims (think of the runaway bride)?

IknowZion, I want to know what information you are privy to that lets you know that "This so-called pastor has been raping, pillaging and plundering for 30years." If you do know this, then you should have stepped forward long ago to stop the raping and pillaging. I want to have more information before I begin with rash judgements and deciding guilt before the first witness even takes the stand.

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18finefamily(4 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Eric you need to wake up. The woman who came forward deserves a ton of credit. You have no idea how hard it would be for a woman of any age to come forward with what happened to her. Dont forget that Dale resigned without being asked do you not think he knows he is guilty and that is why he resigned? If he is so innocent why did he not stay in his position and defend himself? Why because he knows what he did. Not only to her but to all of the parishioners. He along with council took the peoples trust and faith and played with it to their amusement. They will have to answer to God when the die. But in the meantime they should have to answer to the judge and jury in our system. In regards to your victims that aren't victims, the girl was underage Dale was an adult (in age only) he knew better. Your logic that everyone else is wrong makes no sense, Dales actions since the accusations came out shows that loud and clear. People put their trust in the church and the church let them down.If you believe that a young girl who trusted the church and was taken advantage of by Dale is to blame, then you are seriously confused. Dale was in a position to help the girl, not take advantage of her and sentence her
to the emotional termorial she has.What is the ELCA going to do to help her? Since they were not there for her they should at least help her now.
Grow up Eric, this isnt a little he said she said Dale has affected so many people in such a negative way this is serious. Your comment about not actually a victim shows your lack of concern for women in general. Perhaps it runs in your family?

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19JeffLebowski(953 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Eric is right.

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20scrappy(20 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

I must say that some people do just not get it. Dale is a real control freak and certainly he knew just what he wanted and he got it. The young woman that came forward has got to be a wonderful woman. After all these years the turmoil and confusion she must have gone through would be terrible for any woman. And I think she came forward to prevent any other young woman or young minor girls to have to go through what she did. She is a blessing to all, and now the congregation has to know the kind of a person Dale is. If other women are coming forward, what does that tell you??? He is a very sick person, and people trusted him. He seemed to take complete advantage of the congregation, and I have to say, the church council is no better. They knew his antics and let him get away with them. Did he have so much control, that he had everyone completely brainwashed?? It would seem that way to me. I pray for the victims and their families, God only knows what they all have gone through. And for Dale I hope he pays for what he has done to these women, and for the people at Zion.

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21psych(8 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

TO: thinkinoutloud, shiningstar, truthrus, letlightshine, sue, iknowzion and fine family...WOW...aren't we all perfect! What I don't understand is that if everyone was so UNHAPPY and felt that Dale was a control freak, why did you stick around so long? There are many other churches in town. Zion was, and will remain, a good strong church. All former and current pastors and council and committee members should be commended for their hard work to create a wonderful place to worship. It embarasses me that members of Zion will berate "our" church and harbor such negativity when this is a time when we need to put our best foot forward and come together to keep our congregation strong. I am ashamed that people of our own congregation feel the need to publicly put down the church council and insist that they were mere puppets. And no, I am not a member of church council.

I agree with Jeff.....Eric is right!

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22scrappy(20 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

If a pastor resigns under a cloud of suspicion and then he is given 74 K without church members even knowing about it, what does this tell you? I would be totally appalled by this if I were a member of that place. In my opinion that place was organized into a church mafia. To stay there would be a fine example of throwing good money after bad.

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23Eric(196 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

finefamily,

Let's back up a bit... First of all, the girl was NOT underage...she was in her 20s. I suggest you review the previous article on this subject. Second of all, there is a difference between committing an immoral act and a criminal act. I am not doubting that he had sex with the woman (of course, I can't be sure, because I was not there). The point is, did he rape her? This is a pastor, bound to guide people's salvation and uphold the Bible and the Church. I am sure he resigned because the church would certainly have had grounds to terminate him. Probably if he was a convenience store clerk or bartender he wouldn't have resigned. But I will again emphasize that what is considered immoral is not necessarily illegal. For him to be prosecuted criminally he had to have sex against the woman's will. That is what I want the evidence to prove.

I am appalled and upset that you said I, and possibly my family, do not have concern for women. You don't know anything about my family. I find the pastor's actions pathetic and inexcusable. But I am waiting for the evidence to show if his actions were illegal.

Jeff and psych, thank you for the support. And to the fine members of Zion, I really hope the various posters in this forum come to terms with what you are going through. Never do I think that the church council would stand idly by with constructive knowledge of such actions.

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24HundredReasons(31 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

You are either GUILTY or NOT GUILTY. You cannot plead innocent.

Let the trial begin...

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25finefamily(4 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

psych
In response to why did you stick around so long, we didnt. We voiced our concern and and were told that perhaps we would be happier at another church and we are much happier. As for wether or
not he actions were criminal. Give me break as a pastor you you do not take a persons trust in you as a spiritual guide, as a church family leader and abuse it. Church leaders are supposed to be just that, leaders, they are to do what is best for the church. Having any relationship outside of your marraige is wrong, let alone having any with the members of the congregation you are there to lead.
His actions throughout the years have lead to the termoil that the congregation is now in the midst of. There are many good people at Zion. I only hope that they will carefully review their policies and procedures that have allowed many unfavorable actions to occur, and prevent this from occurring again.

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26letlightshine(8 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

from Feb 20 Vindy.."Dawn Cantalamessa, assistant county prosecutor, said the pastor sexually abused the parishioner beginning when she was 15. “He had groomed her from the time she was a minor,” the prosecutor said.

Because the statute of limitations then in effect has expired, however, the charges in the indictment pertain only to crimes allegedly committed during the accuser’s young adulthood, the prosecutor explained."

Predators groom and manipulate powerless vulnerable people. He wouldn't get to first base with most adult women, so look who he preyed on! Can you imagine a person's first sexual experiences being at the hands of Dale Giffin? The damage it has done these now women for the rest of their lives? It took tremendous courage to come forward to Bishop Eaton and to law enforcement, knowing that there would be people out there who would "revictimize" them! My prayers are with them!

No amount of "good work for the kingdom of God" [growing a church membership, impressive programs, no large building [if there's a huge exodus who will pay for the nearly $1.9 million debt? what was he doing leading a congregation into that kind of indebitness?], your personal story of his presence at your marriages, confirmations, baptisms and funerals, none of it should be used to justify the other side of Dale Giffin!

There are more at Zion who were sexually harassed by Dale who know that by coming forward they will be ostracized. So they suffer in silence! I pray for them!

I pray for Bishop Eaton that the council will graciously and humbly invite her back to show they need the help of the larger church in this tragedy that has touched the entire Lutheran community in the Valley!

And I pray that the Prosecutor and his staff do their homework and that justice can be done in what has been called "a defense attorneys town"

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27NOT4ME2JUDGE(1 comment)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

I have been reading & watching comments escalate this past week and a half. I know there is a lot of hate in the world but this is TERRIBLE! NO-ONE, let me REPEAT myself, NO-ONE has the right to judge ANYONE except GOD! Do ANY of you, except Eric, Psych and Jeff hear yourselves or READ what you are saying?! REMEMBER, we ALL (( EVEN JESUS )) deserve our day in COURT (NOT a KANGAROO COURT). You were NOT there when ANY of this was SUPOSEDLY happing and neither was I. So what gives you all the right to JUDGE???? NO, I am not a member of Council but I AM a member of ZION. I LOVE this Church and it's people. My family and I try to do as much as we can WITH and FOR the church. The things you people are saying and stirring up is TERRIBLE! What kind of "CHRISTIANS" are you? OK, Dale was VERY controlling person and had a flawed personality but to accuse ALL these OTHER people of WRONG doing is only tearing the church FARTHER apart when we SHOULD be coming TOGETHER! Some facts; same council members for years? Yes BUT, have any of you who are complaining EVER tried to become a council member and change things? NO! All you have to do is NOMINATE someone in the proper procedure and they are on the ballot! It seems in ALL organiztions there are only a FEW who want to be in charge and they seem to get STUCK with the duties for years until they become IN-ELIGABLE after so many terms. It's not EASY getting people to serve. You ALL want to complain NOW but did you EVER do ANYTHING in the past to HELP out or try to FIX things? YOU should be ashamed of YOURSELVES for trying to tear the people of Zion even FURTHER apart! Yes, Mark and Chuck were GREAT Pastors and we were very SAD to see them leave but you don't tear your church apart for a person. The church is the PEOPLE not the Pastor! STOP trying to tear us apart and START banding together as a congregation so we can HEAL! In case you didn't NOTICE, we DO have a lot of NEW members on council this year and some of the old ones have stepped down. REMEMBER, Jesus said those of you WITHOUT any fault cast the first stone! Are ANY of you PERFECT? It was my belief that only GOD is! So don't try to cast people AWAY from Zion and divide us up! Help bring us ALL together and stop the fighting and ACCUSING or there won't be ANYONE left!!!!!!!!! Is that what GOD wants??? Be a Christion not a Judas!

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28IknowZion(8 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

Eric,
If I told you what I know about Dale, would you believe me, or would you think I was just making things up to stir the pot? How do you know that I stood by without saying a word? And notme2judge, you are doing exactly what you are accusing others of.....judging. I don't think people are trying to tear the congregation apart; I think they are pointing things out that people have the right as members to ask about their own church. After all, the PEOPLE are the church....just as you said.

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29scrappy(20 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

AAAAAAmen!!!!!!!!!!!

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30smiley330(2 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

I have been keeping up with this story ever since it happened. I am not a member of the church but am very close to many of the members there, both members who feel Dale is guilty and members who feel he is innocent. I do ask everyone who prays to pray for all parties involved and pray for the truth to come out. God knows the truth and I hope that it does set everyone free. I also ask you to pray for Pastor Linda who is working so hard at ministering to the spiritual needs of the church. It is very draining physically, emotionally and spiritually. And pray for her husband Pastor Alex is doing his part to support her and the church while ministering at Paradise Lutheran and St. E's Hospital. I have heard that Pastor Frank is leaving at the end of May so Pastor Linda may be even busier. May God bless the entire situation.

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31liveyourbestlife(7 comments)posted 5 years, 9 months ago

My best friend is one of the victims. She was a minor. Very much a minor. There have been more than 15 women come forward. Obviously, not much has been stated to release information of the case because Dale has not been sentenced yet. My friend was told not to tell any one or share her story until everything is finalized. Knowing Dales control of the council the two women contacted the FEMALE Bishop Eaton, once she was contacted many other women came forward to bishop Eaton. And she was the rock in all of this. I give praise to her strength in helping to lead all of this. One of the victims was not from the past, but one was a girl Dale was working on before the two women came forward. Women HAVE come forward (including my friend) to the church counsel, but like it was stated before, they were told to leave, by Dale and by the counsel. When I went through this with my friend, it was clear the "church counsel" was like a cult, following any word dripping off dale's tounge. Dale used what he knew about people's personal and private lives to keep those that knew about his sexual abuse quiet. It's clear Pastor Williams did leave because of it. I suppose he felt he was up against too much. Just as the women felt. My friend missed about a year of high school, and went through intense counciling because of her cutting herself because of this creep. Don't forget the terror he has caused in the dreams of these women. my friend lost her innocence. her innocence to a priest.
To those intrested in this case because they go to that church. . . . .I am so sorry. but he has gotten away with so much. I pray for the congregation of that church. I pray that they can do the right thing for once, and next time, listen to thier instincts. You would be amazed to know, my incredible, strong and forgiving friend prays for that church daily. I hope they have the sense to realize the lesson in all of this and I hope they are praying for the victims as well as themselves. The victims are all aware they have taken the congregation's precious Sunday from them. My questions to the doubtful congregation is. . . Would you rather continue to sit in a pew and hear a lesson from satan dressed as an angel of light? Or stop being self-ish, stand up and do the right thing by protecting women who could have never been victims because you did nothing? Who is your God?

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32IknowZion(8 comments)posted 5 years, 8 months ago

Liveyourbestlife,
I am so sorry for your friend and what she has gone through. Also am sorry for all the other women who had to deal with this horrible abuse. Hopefully, all of these things will come out in court and justice will prevail. It is amazing that one person can have this much power over the lives of so many people. I pray for the victims and the congregation. Hopefully the entire congregation will eventually understand what happened,start the healing process, and get back to doing the work of the Lord.

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33liveyourbestlife(7 comments)posted 5 years, 6 months ago

Neon Bible

A vial of hope and a vial of pain,
In the light they both looked the same.
Poured them out on into the world,
On every boy and every girl singing

It's the Neon Bible, the Neon Bible
Not much chance for survival,
If the Neon Bible is right.

Take the poison of your age
Don't lick your fingers when you turn the page,
What I know is what you know is right
In the city it's the only light.

Oh God! well look at you now!
Oh! you lost it, but you don't know how!
In the light of a golden calf,
Oh God! I had to laugh!

Take the poison of your age
Don't lick your fingers when you turn the page,
It was wrong but you said it was right,
In the future I will read at night.

In the Neon Bible, the Neon Bible
Not much chance for survival,
If the Neon Bible is true.

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34liveyourbestlife(7 comments)posted 5 years, 6 months ago

You know how us Luthren girls can be
We make up for so much time a little too late
I never forgot it, confusing as it was
No fun with no guilt feelings
The sinners, the saviors, the loverless priests
I'll see you next Sunday

We all had our reasons to be there
We all had a thing or two to learn
We all needed something to cling to
So we did

I sang Alleluia in the choir
I confessed my darkest deeds to an envious man
My brother they never went blind for what he did
But I may as well have
In the name of the Father, the Skeptic and the Son
I had one more stupid question

We all had our reasons to be there
We all had a thing or two to learn
We all needed something to cling to
So we did

What I learned I rejected but I believe again
I will suffer the consequence of this inquisition
If I jump in this fountain, will I be forgiven
We all had our reasons to be there
We all had a thing or two to learn
We all needed something to cling to
So we did

We all had delusions in our head
We all had our minds made up for us
We had to believe in something
So we did

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35truthrus(16 comments)posted 5 years, 4 months ago

Has anyone heard when Dale will be going to trial? Heard he has postponed twice and I wondered why????? There is no chance that this trial will simply go away and that he will not be held responsible for his misdeeds, right? Let's talk.

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36truthrus(16 comments)posted 5 years, 3 months ago

Just read the article on Dale Giffin in the Sunday paper....have to say this whole thing makes me so angry! Jerry Ingram would like us to believe that these charges are false because the" rape" was consensual and therefore Dale's case should be dismissed. Ha! I agree with Bishop Eaton when she said that Dale violated the sancity of trust when he crossed that line of engaging in a sexual relationship with a troubled young girl.. not once but over and over again! He was the adult, the trusted minister who brought spiritual guidance to all members of Zion Lutheran Church..or so they thought! I would also like to bring up the ethical question of Judge Evans and his relationship with Dale....during a death in his family Dale was there counciling them in their time of need.. should Judge Evans remove himself from this case?????

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