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Look at what we’ve done



Published: Mon, December 21, 2009 @ 12:00 a.m.

Look at what we’ve done

EDITOR:

Reading The Vindicator recently made me get a knot in my stomach. China has overtaken the U.S. as the world’s biggest market for automobiles. Who could we thank but us?

As I drive and see our senior citizens parading around with a foreign car and a American flag sticking out of their windows — and young ladies, middle age ladies, young men, middle aged men, showing off their new foreign cars — all I can think is I don’t want to hear any of these people crying about why they, their children or grandchildren can’t get a good paying job.

Thank God for GM’s Lordstown plant and Delphi Packard Electric and G.E for being around all these years to help our Valley survive. I know these jobs have downsized, but if you want to be a telemarketer or Walmart nonunion worker at these places of business making a little over minimum wage, we all better wake up.

For all you nonunion workers, next time you see one of us union guys — retired or working — take time to thank us for your hospitalization, sick days, vacation days and all your paid holidays which we and our ancestors fought for.

Merry Christmas to all; lets all fight back to get America back where it belongs No. 1.

ANDY PAPPAGALLO

Mineral Ridge

School board members should be familiar with law

EDITOR:

It is amazing to see our Youngstown school board members know so much less than our general public.

All the information one needs to know about the power the state commission has been given can be found in the Ohio Revised Code and on the state auditor’s web site. The web sites for the auditor, the state board of education, and the codes are all written at a level that anyone with a high school education can understand. There is no interpretation needed. There is nothing wrong with having been elected and not fully armed with the knowledge needed to do an exemplary job, but to remain in the dark after the installation is unforgivable.

When are we going to require more from those we elect? The offices in Columbus will send you without cost copies of excerpts from the relative administrative code. The elements of the commission’s power and authority are easily accessible on the auditor’s web site, as is the performance audit information.

Please note: the commission has yet to exercise its full authority, something I personally waited for.

Our board is seriously remiss, and that is something we all need to remember at election time for our board members.

DELORES T. WOMACK

Youngstown


Comments

1Woody(451 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Andy,

China being a big market for automobiles is a good thing. That means we have a place to export our cars to a people that are buying.

Should I also thank the Union workers for driving business out of the Valley and making it a less attractive place for business to start up or relocate to?

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2Search4Answers(722 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Shouldn't they be building more cars? They have 4 times as many people as we do.

I love my Indiana/Ohio built foreign car, better than anything I've had from Michigan.

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3Search4Answers(722 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

If any area is supporting American brands it's this area. Its one of the few areas where you are in a minority if you are in foreign branded car. I see plenty of those new chevy sedans especially in this area.

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4PAPPY(14 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

TO THE UNION BASHERS, TALK TO ANYBODY WHO WORKS AT WALMARTS OR AT A TELEMARKETER PLACE THEY GET TREATED LIKE LITTLE KIDS AND ARE ALWAYS BEING BELITTLED. GO TO HUNTINGTON BANK AND LOOK AT ALL THE NEW WORKERS IN THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS, THEY CAME UP TO THEM AND SAID FRIDAY'S YOUR LAST DAY. NO UNION GOOD BYE, THEY HIRED NEW WORKERS AT A LOWER RATE AND BENEFITS. KEEP BUYING YOUR FOREIGN CARS YOU KIDS WILL HAVE A NICE JOB BEING A WALMART GREETER. REMEMBER YOU HAVE BENEFITS AND VACATION DAYS BECAUSE A UNION MAN FOUGHT FOR THEM. AS FAR AS AUTO WORKERS BEING GREEDY IF YOU NEVER WORKED IN A AUTO PLANT YOU WOULDN'T UNDERSTAND THEY ARE WOTH EVERY PENNY. HEART ATTACK RATE AND CANCER ARE HIGHER AMONG THESE WORKERS THEN ANYWHERE ELSE. MOVE TO JAPAN OR CHINA THEY WILL TAKE YOU AND GIVE YOU A BOWL OF RICE FOR A GOOD DAYS WORK!!!!!!

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5HaydenThomas(208 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

What's the matter pappy, had to create yet another screen name so that your pro union garbage wasn't recognized as one of the usual culprits? Unions have destroyed the valley. Unions positive influence was decades ago and since then they've killed industry after industry. Get educated and make yourself marketable and highly paid. Forget about holding companies hostage for wages far beyond what unskilled labor should make. Quit whining about the good old days and make a future for yourself.

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6PAPPY(14 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

NEVER HAD A LOG ON NAME MR HAYDEN, JUST CREATED ONE TODAY. I'M DOING QUITE WELL IN LIFE FOR BEING "UNDER EDUCATED".
YOU SOUND LIKE A COLLEGE EXCUTIVE, BOOK SMART WORLD DUMB. 12TH GRADE CHANEY HIGH EDUCATION AND PROUD OF IT. I'M THINKING ABOUT THE YOUNGER GENERATIONS NOT MYSELF!!!

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7Search4Answers(722 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

It's the union parts of America that are holding it back.

Its a fact of life you can't make it today on a high school education alone. No longer the days of "why go to college when you're just going to be working at the mills/GM".

It might have been a century ago that unions moved America forward but for the last two decades it has been holding her back for sure.

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8Stan(9923 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

I benefit from GM . I drive GM . I support GM .

Lordstown GM assembly is here because of those who labored there in years gone by . Delphi has seen its technology and plants shipped to Mexico . Now those who built the goose that laid the golden eggs are ctiticized . There are two ways for The Valley to go . One is for total decay like a compost heap and the other is to sprout new industrial life . LET'S KEEP ANY NEW DEVELOPING TECHNOLOGY IN AMERICA FOR AMERICANS ! Export the goods but not the manufacturing technology !

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9cambridge(2984 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Search4 Answers...."It's the union parts of America that are holding it back."

California is the most union state in the nation and it has the 8th largest economy in the world and 1/4 of the worlds fortune 500 companies.

Less than 8% of the nations private labor is union but some people point to them as a cause of their own misery. No wait, it's the Democrats, no wait it's the Republicans, no wait it's that 3% of the population that are here illegally, no wait it's minorities, no wait it's the non-believers, no wait it's the non white Europeans and on and on, that's what's causing these chronic complainers to have such miserable lives.

It's that or maybe these are just chronically miserable people?

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10mj(2 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Again I see we are divided. Unions vs. Non-unions, Democrats verses Republicans. The bottom line is that wages in the United States are going backwards. Education is a requirement for the future, but is starting off in life $40,000 to $50,000 in college debut than raising a family really going to improve the economic situation? Unions have not destroyed America; it is jealousy and agreed that we have amongst each other. It is time to stop worrying about everyone else, and take responsibility for the actions we have chosen in life. The hatred in America must stop.

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11cambridge(2984 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Useless1....I blame the chronic complainers. mj's comment was right on the mark. "stop worrying about everyone else, and take responsibility for the actions we have chosen in life."

I live in the same wold everyone else does. I've worked since I was kid. I've never let anyone hold me back and I've never blamed anyone else for what I "don't" have.

When I hear people like you constantly complain how everyone else is causing hardship in "your" life I laugh. I belong to or worked with unions my whole life and I have nothing against anyone who doesn't care to belong to a union. I have never seen any union member posting personal attacks against people that chose to work non union but you see post here by the thousands about how this 7%+ portion of the work force is ruining America. I see that as a bunch of cry baby losers from the Moaning Valley who are unable to take control and responsibility in their own lives.

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12HaydenThomas(208 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

What Cambridge fails to mention about California is that most of the unions are government unions and the California government is broke because of the unions. He also forgets to mention that most of California's fortune 500 companies are non union IT companies, many in silicon valley that pay excellent wages and don't need unions. Isn't it nice how people can provide part of the story to support what is an invalid position.

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13HaydenThomas(208 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Cambridge also says stop worrying about everyone else. I agree and the UAW should get out of the taxpayers pocket then. I shouldn't have to pay for failing industries whose employees are the sole cause of that industries decline. It's a 2 way street. I'm educated and doing very well and shouldn't have to pay for some unskilled laborer via taxes who didn't have the foresight to see that his extraction of compensation beyond what his unskilled labor should pay would cause his company to fail. Quit taking money from the skilled producers for the unskilled non producers. No jobs bank at my company.

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14VINDYAK(1799 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Not only is China the largest market for automobiles in the world, it is also now the largest manufacturer of automobiles in the world. China produced over 10 million vehicles last year. Those vehicles cannot be exported to the good old USA yet, because they do not meet emission standards of our country. But, watch out. They will soon be here. They needed a network of dealers first, and with the purchase of the Hummer brand (that our government forced GM to sell), China now has access to dealerships all across the US. There are also other dealers who lost their Chrysler and GM franchises who are looking for a brand to sell. So, watch out, here they come and they will be priced lower than US brands.

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15HaydenThomas(208 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Cambridge, most of the industries failing are union. Auto, Steel, Airline, and Governments which is where most of the union employees are nowadays. Any coincidence that most government entities are broke?

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16cambridge(2984 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

HaydenThomas.....California doesn't have the revenue to run the government because a 60% majority vote is needed for and change in the tax base. The legislators vote along party lines with no regard for the citizens and tax payers. California is far from broke, it's just in political gridlock.

I don't know of any Fortune 500 "IT" companies. If your referring to the micro electronics industry, unions are well represented and the ongoing construction end of the business is pretty much 100% union. I worked for construction companies that built Silicon Valley as a worker in the field and latter in the engineering end of the business.

As far as the unskilled labor in the American auto industry I think they would be found in the board room and I resent subsidising the unskilled non producers running the financial institutions and Wall Street.

It's obvious you think your white collar makes you better than someone with a blue collar, It doesn't. I've worn both and you need to get over yourself.

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17HaydenThomas(208 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Again with the partial and incorrect information. California is broke because government workers received wages and benefits based on the housing bubble that generated tax receipts way above what was sustainable. Now that the bubble broke, some cities in California are filing bankruptcy because the safety forces (union) refuse to take concessions to balance the budget. Sound familiar?

I've also worn both collars. I don't claim to be better, just better educated and prepared for the economy and workforce of the future. Instead of whining consistently that the taxpayers need to bail out failed industries, get trained and get better employment.

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18HaydenThomas(208 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

The financial institutions either are paying back the bailouts or will pay back the bailouts. GM will do no such thing. Nothing but a giveaway to failed industries. Payback for UAW support.

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19cambridge(2984 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

USEless1.....California is not bankrupt, it does not pay it's bills with script, the hospitals are not bankrupt and the Governor is Republican. I keep telling you, just because it's rattling around in your head doesn't make it true.

I'd be interested to know how much time you or HaydenThomas have spent in California to make you both such experts. If it makes the both of you feel better to believe that when that 7% of the work force is non union your life will somehow be better you go right ahead. I've already given my opinion on that scenario in post 14.

As far as bailing out the American auto industry, it was the board room not the unions that went to Washington with there hats in their hand. The price tag for saving the American Auto industry was about what Bush spent in Iraq every four months for six and a half years. Tell me which one was the better investment.

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20mom8890(5 comments)posted 4 years, 8 months ago

Seriously people, my education is no more than high school, and I have a VERY good non union paying job right here in good old Mahoning Vally. There are good jobs in Mahoning Valley that you are not required to have a useless degree to get. I raised two kids on my own with this job and lived very comfortably. The problem with this country is there are way too many people who want everything handed to them on a silver platter instead of going out and making something of themselves and for themselves. This has nothing to do with whether or not a union is involved, it's all about making a good life for yourself and not worrying about what is going on around you. And just for the record, as I passed by the Southern Park Mall this past weekend I find it hard to believe that anyone in this area is feeling any kind of recession with all the people out spending money that they claim they don't have. RIDICULOUS...GET OVER YOURSELVES!!!

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212ez2c(17 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

last time i checked most of the vally didnt look rich enough to keep buying and fixing gm cars. so why wouldnt they buy a honda made in columbus or a toyota made in ky.? i want a car to last for me and my family so we can spend our money on ourselves not our p.o.s car. i love my honda shame on you greedy union mobsters...tell your children the truth ,g.m is going to be just like A.M.C by the time they are old enough to buy a car

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22Stan(9923 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

I seen your tracks in the snow this morning and they weren't on the road . By the looks of things I'm sure that car will need an infusion of money . It was't the fault of GM . You didn't get the right model . The Hummer would have made that off road journey for just the fuel expense . Since you and others like you didn't buy one GM has quit making them . Could I sell you and Amish Buggy ? The drive trains regenerate themselves if you buy a male and female drive train .

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232ez2c(17 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

the hummer was one of gms biggest jokes

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24casper77(136 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

The people that bash the union are the ones who work two jobs to make ends meet. I guess they think this is the right way to live ,if you call that living. The CEOs love people like you. Remember when only you Dad have to work to provide for the whole Family. In our lifetime ,we will see Chinese tanks rolling down our streets because the USA has become a third world nation ,thanks to all of you who keeps buying their goods. We are building up China to a superpower way greater than us. It will be only a matter of time when they will not fear our military and take over the world. It's not the first time China has done this. So go head and buy your foreign goods but you better learn Chinese too.

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25casper77(136 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

Right now China and India are out-bidding the USA on all the rights to natural gas ,oil ,coal etc. costing us double, even triple ,of what we paid only 5 years ago. Once their economy gets rolling and all the world resources get depleted ,there will be Wars over Oil, Gas etc.You say why don't people go to college if they want a higher paying job, well let me tell you about some people who did go to college for 4 years and $60,000 college loan debt to get a job for $11.00 an hour. That her co-worker had $3.00 an hour taken away, because of the economy, and there is nothing she can do because it is a non-union shop

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26casper77(136 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

You can't get a job in the south, they only hire illegals at below wages.

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27cambridge(2984 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

USEless1...."Did any of the union free automakers need a bailout from the taxpayers just to stay in business?"

The Japanese auto makers have been subsidized by the Japanese government for decades and they put high tariffs on US autos going into Japan.

Try to keep up.

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28casper77(136 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

Yes They did get a bail-out. Ask senator Shelby and Corker, They give them cash for clunkers program. Who benefited from it? You guessed it FOREIGN CAR MAKERS.Did your country USA 1 ,Japan, Help any USA car makers in Japan NO!!!!! We,re lucky if any foreign car makers are in Japan

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29Search4Answers(722 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

Cambridge, that is what we did to the Japanese years ago... that's why they moved production here in the 80's to avoid the tariffs.

GM's problems aren't solely because they are union. Blame goes all around at that company. From unions to management to the engineers; there isn't a hand in that company that didn't contribute to its demise. Chrysler just made cheap crap no one wanted to buy, their problems were pretty darn obvious for years especially after Diamler took them over.

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30cambridge(2984 comments)posted 4 years, 7 months ago

USEless1....You can put any label on my "practices" you want. I couldn't care less. But whatever you want to call them they've made me a millionaire.

You're the one cashing the social security check not me. I'm retired since 2004 and living on my investments. I get nothing from the government. Can you say the same? I'm sure you would never use socialist medicare right?

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